Need simple easy to follow advice

Support & discussion regarding DAWs and MIDI sequencers.

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Ontical2
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Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by Ontical2 »

I am totally new to Linux.

I have installed Linux Mint.

I have installed Ableton Live 9 Standard and need to use my Focusrite Scarlett 4i4 with it. I have installed Jack and Alsa but can't fathom it's bewildering settings. Installed Focusrite drivers through Vine but they don't work. Can't open Focusrite Control as it doesn't recognise a device. I can use my 4i4 as an MME/Direct X soundcard but it has latency. ASIO doesn't work.

Really clueless as to what to do to make this all work as it does in Windows.

Help appreciated in advance.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by Impostor »

Best advice you'll probably ever get: If you've invested heavily in Windows software, run Windows.
Second best advice: Cut your losses and learn to use a Linux native daw.

That was easy!

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by j_e_f_f_g »

I agree 100% with imposter. If you insist upon running Windows software, and you "need simple easy", then Linux is not going to be for you. Running non-native software (ie, written for a different operating system) is typically a challenge on any OS. And non-native music software on Linux is an especially daunting challenge (for historical reasons I won't get into here). Anyone who leads you to believe otherwise is either not being honest with you, or doesn't kmow enough to realize that they're setting you up for an experience guaranteed to be frustrating, and likely unproductive.

The only way you'll come close to "simple easy" with Linux audio/music production is to:

1) Choose/use music/audio apps written for Linux. Favor software written by developers who frequent this forum (QTractor, Muse, Guitarix, etc), as you'll get the most prompt, accurate, and personalized assistance.

2) Use a specialty distro configured precisely for audio/music such as "AV Linux". It will have most everything you need to start with, already setup for you. And it will be easier to add whtever else you need. Don't use a generic version of linux, such as Mint or Ubuntu. (Use those only after you've gained the linux expertise to do what the person who makes a music distro has already done for you).

3) If raboof asks to "come up to <his> apartment for a nightcap", don't go.

ps. If you're looking live background accompaniment software, try "Backupband" (link below in my signature).

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by Gps »

You do not need to install the scarlett driver though.

Vid is about 2i2 but same goes for 4i4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zFA5piXf8Q

And
https://github.com/Focusrite-Scarlett-o ... -load-time

But Albeton can be a problem, because its not native Linux. I know some who use it anyway though.

On Linux I would advise a native Linux daw, or as the two above said, use windows.

I use LMMS which is a bit of a fruity loops clone, but it cant record audio.

https://www.slant.co/topics/6067/~daws-for-linux

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by tavasti »

I have tried few windows DAWs in linux (Ableton Lite, Mixcraft at least), and could not get decent latency. Your best bets: go back to windows if you need to run Ableton or keep Linux and get Bitwig (or some other Linux DAW, Bitwig is the one that would be best at par with Ableton)

Last edited by tavasti on Tue May 30, 2023 8:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by tavasti »

artix_linux_user wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 6:39 am

yeah the best advice you will ever get: run windows.
dont run linux, it is so complicated to learn, you will need this cable input device...a mouse...and this thing with the words on it....was it keyboard?

For running windows-programs, that is good option. Personally, I haven't used Windows actively since 1994 when I switched to linux, so I can't say much about problems you will have with it. When ever I have to touch it, I will lose my temper :-)

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by tavasti »

artix_linux_user wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 8:33 am

Yes, running Windows might be an option, might be necessary.
Using wordings like the best advice is too far fetched.

Yeah, true, I edited my answer to reflect better what I really wanted to say. Thanks for noting.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

Gps wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 1:03 am

You do not need to install the scarlett driver though.

Vid is about 2i2 but same goes for 4i4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zFA5piXf8Q

And
https://github.com/Focusrite-Scarlett-o ... -load-time

But Albeton can be a problem, because its not native Linux. I know some who use it anyway though.

On Linux I would advise a native Linux daw, or as the two above said, use windows.

I use LMMS which is a bit of a fruity loops clone, but it cant record audio.

https://www.slant.co/topics/6067/~daws-for-linux

What @Gps said. Tip on two Linux native DAW's:

  1. QTractor (can be installed via your favourite package manager), its developer is active on this forum.

  2. Reaper Linux native version (link). It's (sort of) free/cheap and available for all operating systems. Learn how to use it once, be happy on any platform for the rest of your life.

Good luck choosing between operating system, hardware and software. :)

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by j_e_f_f_g »

artix_linux_user wrote:

That's the Muse Research Receptor
It has linux as operating system to run windows vst plugins...because, the devs are quite sure that Linux would be better suited then Windows

Don't even go there. There are some big issues with the Receptor. You're limited to running only those VSTs that Muse Research relicenses, and recompiles to work, with their proprietary, closed-source "linux vst host". You can't just load/run any windows VST you want. You have to buy whatever version VSTs are available from the Muse store. This is a total lock-in worse than Apple. And frankly, I don't think that linux being supposedly "better suited" for running Windows VSTs was ever in their minds. It was simply a way for them to bypass paying for Windows licensing, as there are plenty of complaints from customers about the Receptor's reliability on the gig. In fact, I think they make linux look bad.

Don't ever utter that name here again.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by Loki Harfagr »

artix_linux_user wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 2:26 pm

thanks for your opinion.

That didn't seem to be an opinion but a factual diagnosis.

artix_linux_user wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 2:26 pm

Secondly, as I am reading your words I am reading a strong contradiction:

j_e_f_f_g wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 1:59 pm

You're limited to running only those VSTs that Muse Research relicenses

versus

j_e_f_f_g wrote: Tue May 30, 2023 1:59 pm

It was simply a way for them to bypass paying for Windows licensing

SO they have to license and recompile the plugins and they are doing it because they do not want to license plugins?

Read again having in mind this basic lemma: Windows_licensing /not_equal_to/ relicensing_selected_vsts

But thanks for your opinion anyway :wink:

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by j_e_f_f_g »

artix_linux_user wrote:

some musicians who are using it... are still absolutly excited about it.

I have no idea why they would be. You can easily get the same thing by buying a rackmount computer, loading it with Windows and all those VSTs you would otherwise need to buy from Muse (except now you don't need "altered" versions that aren't compatible with any updates released by the original vendor). And the result would be more efficient, cheaper, upgradeable, and repairable (not exclusively by Muse).

And that brings me to the thing that I absolutely loathe about Muse. Their advertising is factually deceptive and preys upon consumer ignorance. Here's the thing. The receptor uses an asian knockoff motherboard with an Intel 80x86 based CPU (amd as I recall), standard computer RAM, a standard hard drive, an audio card that I strongly suspect is a variation of the MAudio 2496 or Delta LT (I wouldn't be surprised if they contracted MAudio to make it for them), a computer power supply, and all other manner of off-the-shelf computer parts. And it runs linux, which is a computer operating system, which in turns runs computer software (vsts). And yet they're absolutely hyperbolic in insisting this thing "isn't a computer". It especially isn't a computer running linux, they insist. They would be seriously furious about you depicting it as such. Note the very first item in their "faq".

It's a eff'ing computer. But Muse doesn't want consumers to know that because then people like me can do something like I did on another forum, which to price out an actual, comparable rackmount computer system which is more powerful than the receptor at half the price. These guys are snakeoil salesmen.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by j_e_f_f_g »

Uh oh. I haven't visited the Muse webpage in a few years, so I just went there to see what they're currently upto. They've stopped making the receptor, and in fact all hardware. They're trying to sell their (software) IP (intellectual property). I wouldn't be surprised if the company liquidates soon. It looks like their engaging in some sort of business exit strategy.

I hope your musician friends are aware that their ability to obtain updates, repairs, etc may be in jeopardy.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by j_e_f_f_g »

Oh dear. Their online forums have completely disappeared. It looks like they don't want to hear their customers' reactions to their recent business activities.

And although they no longer sell hardware, they haven't even bothered to update their products page to reflect any currently available products. It looks like they no longer are selling anything except their IP.

This is bad for receptor owners. Really bad.

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by j_e_f_f_g »

artix_linux_user wrote:

a company going the next step

This doesn't look like a "next step" so much as a "final step". And that step appears to be into a six foot deep hole that will soon be filled in with dirt.

They're not "selling licenses". They're selling their IP (ie, all rights to exclusively manufacture their entire product line).

Assuming they ever do find a buyer, what do you imagine Muse Research will do after that???

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Re: Need simple easy to follow advice

Post by Audiojunkie »

J_e_f_f_g and I may not see eye to eye on the Pipewire/JACK debate, but I'm definitely agreed with him on this. You can do so much better than a MUSE device these days. I admit that I wanted one years ago. But look at the specs on their most recent device--it's ancient. They haven't been supported in years. Their OS hasn't seen ANY of the updates that the Linux kernel and WINE (or any part of the OS, really). Yes, things run on it. But I wouldn't guarantee it would run any newer VSTS. One could do so much better and for so much cheaper.

That said, if someone already has a MUSE Receptor device, you might as well try to get the most out of it. :)

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