Best FM synth?

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Best FM synth?

Post by tavasti »

I found out old windows FM synth DoubleSix ( https://vst4you.com/pages/vst%20instrum ... lesix.html )

But is there some great linux native FM synths? Dexed is not enough, I want something which has also other waveforms than sine.

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by occulkot »

I think that F.'em have different waveforms but it is payed software.
Other option would be using cardinal and fall into unlimited world of modulars
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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by tavasti »

occulkot wrote: Tue Aug 23, 2022 7:56 pm I think that F.'em have different waveforms but it is payed software.
Other option would be using cardinal and fall into unlimited world of modulars
F.'em costs a fortune, so that is not option for me.

Cardinal, interesting point. That would be valid reason to learn it. How complicated it is to make patch with 2 OSC which have own envelope, and second is FM modulated with first? And is feedback possible?

One option would be learn FM features in Tranzistow. Not easy thing, and don't know if there is any documentation / instructions available for it

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by LAM »

tavasti wrote: Tue Aug 23, 2022 7:48 pm I found out old windows FM synth DoubleSix ( https://vst4you.com/pages/vst%20instrum ... lesix.html )

But is there some great linux native FM synths? Dexed is not enough, I want something which has also other waveforms than sine.
Oxe Fm Synth has different waveforms
tavasti wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 5:57 am Cardinal, interesting point. That would be valid reason to learn it. How complicated it is to make patch with 2 OSC which have own envelope, and second is FM modulated with first? And is feedback possible?
There are several tutorial on YT about FM, mostly done in VCV, but you can apply the same concepts in Cardinal

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by folderol »

{cough}Yoshimi{cough} AddSynth->Voice->Waveform->Modulator :D

P.S. Always take a ball of string with you when you go down the rabbit hole!
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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by LAM »

folderol wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 6:48 am {cough}Yoshimi{cough} AddSynth->Voice->Waveform->Modulator :D

P.S. Always take a ball of string with you when you go down the rabbit hole!
Right, beside Yoshimi most of the modern FOSS synths (Zyn, Surge/SurgeXT, Odin2...) can do it too.

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by tavasti »

folderol wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 6:48 am {cough}Yoshimi{cough} AddSynth->Voice->Waveform->Modulator :D
Yeah, ZynAddSubFX and Yoshimi do have FM modulator, but you can have only one modulator for one voice, and not multiple, chained or parallel.

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by folderol »

tavasti wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 7:00 am
folderol wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 6:48 am {cough}Yoshimi{cough} AddSynth->Voice->Waveform->Modulator :D
Yeah, ZynAddSubFX and Yoshimi do have FM modulator, but you can have only one modulator for one voice, and not multiple, chained or parallel.
Not quite sure why you'd want more, however in Yoshi (dunno about Zyn) you can do the following:
Voice 1 modulated but volume set to zero
Voice 2 - whole of voice one further modulated - volume zero
Voice 3 - whole of voice 2 further modulated - use this or go on all the way to 8
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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by tavasti »

folderol wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 7:17 am Not quite sure why you'd want more, however in Yoshi (dunno about Zyn) you can do the following:
Voice 1 modulated but volume set to zero
Voice 2 - whole of voice one further modulated - volume zero
Voice 3 - whole of voice 2 further modulated - use this or go on all the way to 8
To be honest, I don't know even myself what FM can do and what not, and how many modulators are needed. However, classical DX7 modulation operators include stuff like this:
modulators.jpg
modulators.jpg (2.54 KiB) Viewed 7127 times
So I assume is makes sense to have longer chain of modulators, at least in some circumstances.

And yeah, functionality seems to be there also in Zyn, just needed some time to spot it. Configuring and understanding dependencies would be easier with some clear matrix display, like in F.'em but sure it is different: zyn and yoshimi are more complete synths, containing much more than fm only.

I think this is really great tip from you, zyn/yosh are anyway my faw synths, and now just learning better to use them.

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by LAM »

tavasti wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 11:05 am And yeah, functionality seems to be there also in Zyn, just needed some time to spot it. Configuring and understanding dependencies would be easier with some clear matrix display, like in F.'em but sure it is different: zyn and yoshimi are more complete synths, containing much more than fm only.
LAM wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 6:44 am Oxe Fm Synth has different waveforms
Oxe Fm Synth has a modulation matrix:

Image

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by folderol »

re: Yoshimi
For parallel modulation you keep the volume up, and for the other voices, you select voice 1 waveform (instead of the internal one).

One of the modulation types that is hardly ever used is the Morph type - because people don't think it does anything!
That's because they don't realise you must enable the envelope for it, as that is what sweeps between the voice waveform and the modulation one :roll:
Put the envelope in 'Free' mode and you can have up to 40 sweeps (or partial ones) between them while sounding.
For a bit of fun, set the first few sweeps with fairly short times, with each successive one being a bit longer so you get a sort of bounce slowing down.
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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by Basslint »

I know SurgeXT is used for FM synth. If you want to do more complex stuff, perhaps it's best to use PureData so you have fine-grained control of everything.
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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by tavasti »

LAM wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 11:22 am
tavasti wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 11:05 am And yeah, functionality seems to be there also in Zyn, just needed some time to spot it. Configuring and understanding dependencies would be easier with some clear matrix display, like in F.'em but sure it is different: zyn and yoshimi are more complete synths, containing much more than fm only.
LAM wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 6:44 am Oxe Fm Synth has different waveforms
Oxe Fm Synth has a modulation matrix:

Image
This looks like pretty potential thing. UI is not the best, but tolerable.
Basslint wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 12:39 pm I know SurgeXT is used for FM synth. If you want to do more complex stuff, perhaps it's best to use PureData so you have fine-grained control of everything.
Biggest flaw is that FM Depth is not adjustable separately for each OSC. And sure, 3 OSC is bit limited.

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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by shorty »

I think cardinal is the way to go, have a look at this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BmFnA0YsUc

fm synthesis with two bogaudio modules.
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Re: Best FM synth?

Post by tavasti »

tavasti wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 11:05 am
folderol wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 7:17 am Not quite sure why you'd want more, however in Yoshi (dunno about Zyn) you can do the following:
...
And yeah, functionality seems to be there also in Zyn, just needed some time to spot it.
...
I think this is really great tip from you, zyn/yosh are anyway my faw synths, and now just learning better to use them.
Found out that in Zyn that feature is broken. When modulating with other osc, that osc is used unmodulated. Meaning you cannot really do chained modulations with it. Worth reporting bug.

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