[ANN] yabridge 5.1.0, a long-awaited maintenance release

Discuss running non-Linux applications and plugins on Linux, for example via wine

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Vrangor
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 3.8.1

Post by Vrangor »

@Linuxmusician01
My "gear" has 2Ghz Pentium M and 2 GB of RAM. As far as my project goes, i know that YABridge probably won't be useful in this case. DAW options are Ardour and Reaper, the first one seems a bit heavy, Reaper is a lightweight. Yet i have to search for some nice eq, comp, delay and reverb. TBH i`ve never used native plugins except Reaper native.
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 3.8.1

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

Vrangor wrote: Wed Mar 23, 2022 9:50 pm @Linuxmusician01
My "gear" has 2Ghz Pentium M and 2 GB of RAM. As far as my project goes, i know that YABridge probably won't be useful in this case. DAW options are Ardour and Reaper, the first one seems a bit heavy, Reaper is a lightweight. Yet i have to search for some nice eq, comp, delay and reverb. TBH i`ve never used native plugins except Reaper native.
I use Qtractor as a DAW on my antique eeePC. Works just fine. Dunno 'bout Reaper. It has a Linux native version but I have a sneakin' suspicion that it's not as light weight as a DAW that was developed from the ground up for Linux. I ain't no programmer but I think that the Reaper version for Linux is an adapted version of the Windows one. I could be totally wrong of course...

Anyway, the YABridge 32 bit version that's posted in this topic doesn't work for you? I still have to test it on my 32 bit Linux machine...

Have you tried Carla to bridge Windows VST's to Linux on your 32 bit computer?
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 3.8.1

Post by Vrangor »

I think that the Reaper version for Linux is an adapted version of the Windows one. I could be totally wrong of course...

Anyway, the YABridge 32 bit version that's posted in this topic doesn't work for you? I still have to test it on my 32 bit Linux machine...

Have you tried Carla to bridge Windows VST's to Linux on your 32 bit computer?
Actually Reaper is a lot lighter on that machine, it's almost invisible to system unless playing/recording/processing, while Ardour just when loading up eats whole resources and even puts a few xruns and then stays pretty visible at cpu time even when idle.
About yabridge, it works, but is really unusable as one or two plugins in idle session make system overloaded and stop responding. I gave up on Carla some time ago as whenever i tried it never worked for windows vst out of the box. But it's ok! This has to be machine just to fire up and record. However finally it starts a windowmaker session with DAW instead daw straight under X, as i couldnt manage it to start fullscreen.
And about Reaper as this project's audio engine, it has all plugins i need, ReaEQ is great, i built a nice drumkit on ReaSamplomatic, and the only thing i couldn't replace as far now is Density mkIII compressor as it's winVST only. I use all the mentioned software including yabridge and winVSTs without any problems on more recent 64bit systems, maybe except Carla:).
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[ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by robbert-vdh »

TL;DR: If you don't have the time to read the entire post, do make sure to still check out the first bullet under the 'yabridgectl' section of the changelog.

It's been a couple of months, but today's the day to finally release yabridge 4.0. The original plan was to also work on ARA2 support for this release, but most of these changes have already been sitting idly on the master branch since April as I didn't have any time to prepare a proper release in the meantime. So it seemed like a good idea to just get these things out of the way first, as there are a several significant quality of life improvements in here.

So, what changed? In short, almost everything. But, at least in theory, after the initial `yabridgectl sync`, everything should work exactly as it always has worked or better. All of these changes and many more are covered in more detail in the changelog. So if you're interested, then I encourage you to read that as well.

The biggest change in yabridge 4.0 is very technical, but it will improve the experience of using yabridge considerably. Yabridge has always consisted of two components: a plugin library a native VST2 or VST3 host can load, and a Wine plugin host application that can host Windows VST2 and VST3 plugins. Both components talk to each other to pass through messages or function calls, and they are thus coupled very tightly together. Because of that, updating one but not the other may result in crashes or other unexpected behavior. And as a result, you had to always rerun `yabridgectl sync` after updating yabridge in order to replace old yabridge library copies with fresh ones. This can be a problem when installing yabridge through a distro's package manager, as the package may have been updated without you realizing it. Yabridge would pop up a desktop notification warning you about this, but even that may not work if the old yabridge library copies were compiled against older version of Boost as the host would now be completely unable to load the plugin. To remedy these problems, yabridge 4.0 no longer copies the entire plugin libraries around. Instead, yabridgectl now using these new, dependencyless shim libraries while the main yabridge files stay in their place. These shim libraries are tiny plugins that simply search the system for the actual yabridge files, load them, and then forward all function calls to them. This somewhat resembles the chainloading process used by boot loaders, and yabridge thus borrows that term to refer to this process. As a result of this, yabridge plugins can no longer go out of sync as the chainloader will always load the correct version of the yabridge plugin library, even if you didn't rerun `yabridgectl sync` after an upgrade. In addition, this approach slightly reduces the time it takes to set up plugins, and plugins take up less disk space if you aren't using Btrfs or XFS (in which case yabridgectl uses reflinks instead of copies).

The second user facing change is that VST2 plugins are now set up in `~/.vst/yabridge` by default, just like VST3 plugins are set up in `~/.vst3/yabridge`. This way you only need to make sure your DAW searches through `~/.vst` for VST2 plugins, and it will automatically be able to find all of your yabridge plugins. Be sure to read the bullet under the 'yabridgectl' section in the changelog for more detailed migration instructions, but the short version is that you simply need to make sure that your DAW searches for VST2 plugins in `~/.vst`, and that it no longer searches for plugins in any of your Windows plugin directories. After running `yabridgectl sync`, yabridgectl will inform you about the leftover `.so` files in your Windows plugin directories from yabridge 3.x. Simply read through that list to make sure there's nothing in there that shouldn't be deleted, and then rerun the command as `yabridgectl sync --prune` to remove them. If you want to stick with the old way to set up VST2 plugins instead of them being set up in `~/.vst/yabridge`, then there is an option available to do so through `yabridgectl set`.

There are many more noticeable changes, but the most important ones I should mention here are in yabridge's shared memory handling and in yabridgectl's post-installation setup checks. Yabridge uses desktop notifications to inform you about things that are going terribly wrong, and yabridgectl now also checks whether `notify-send` is installed after running `yabridgectl sync`. This ensures that you won't miss any important messages. The shared memory handling change relates to how yabridge handles the locking of shared memory. Yabridge uses shared memory to share audio buffers between the native plugin and the Wine plugin host, and it tries to lock that shared memory to main memory to prevent it from being swapped out to the disk. Previously yabridge would simply terminate if it couldn't do so, but now it will fall back to not using memory locking if the user doesn't have permissions to do so. It will, however, still show you an annoying desktop notification until you fix this.

On the backend side, a lot has changed. The biggest change is that the dependency on Boost has been completely removed, and everything has been reworked accordingly. This should make packaging easier, as yabridge now no longer depends on any system library other than the basic libraries needed to interact with X11. Some parts of Boost have been replaced by other headers-only libraries, while other parts now simply use custom implementations. All of this is explained in more detail in the 'Packaging notes' section of the changelog. Yabridgectl also lost its dependency on winedump, at least in most cases. It now tries to parse plugin libraries directly using the goblin binary parsing library. This should also speed up the syncing process. I did, however, run into one plugin that this new parser couldn't handle. If that happens then winedump will still be used instead.

There are many more changes, so I encourage you to read the full changelog below. Oh and on a completely unrelated note, I've been working on a CLAP and VST3 plugin framework and a suite of plugins in Rust, so be sure to check that out as well if you're interested: https://github.com/robbert-vdh/nih-plug

You can find the full changelog with an exhaustive list of new features, improvements, and fixes here:

https://github.com/robbert-vdh/yabridge ... /tag/4.0.0
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

Thanks for the clarification.

However, I still have one question. On the Yabridge website it says "Yabridge seamlessly supports using both 32-bit and 64-bit [...] plugins". But there's also Bitbridge as a part of YABridge. And Bitbridge "It is also possible to compile a host application for yabridge that's compatible with 32-bit plugins such as old SynthEdit plugins. This will allow yabridge to act as a bitbridge".

Why is there Bitbridge?
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by robbert-vdh »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:03 pm Thanks for the clarification.

However, I still have one question. On the Yabridge website it says "Yabridge seamlessly supports using both 32-bit and 64-bit [...] plugins". But there's also Bitbridge as a part of YABridge. And Bitbridge "It is also possible to compile a host application for yabridge that's compatible with 32-bit plugins such as old SynthEdit plugins. This will allow yabridge to act as a bitbridge".

Why is there Bitbridge?
To allow you to use 32-bit plugins. :) You can't load 32-bit libraries in a 64-bit application or the other way around. So yabridge comes with both 32-bit and 64-bit host applications that can respectively load 32-bit and 64-bit Windows plugin libraries. And they both talk the same protocol as the native 64-bit plugin libraries, which is why you can seamlessly use both 32-bit and 64-bit Windows plugins.
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

robbert-vdh wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:26 pm
Linuxmusician01 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:03 pm Thanks for the clarification.

However, I still have one question. On the Yabridge website it says "Yabridge seamlessly supports using both 32-bit and 64-bit [...] plugins". But there's also Bitbridge as a part of YABridge. And Bitbridge "It is also possible to compile a host application for yabridge that's compatible with 32-bit plugins such as old SynthEdit plugins. This will allow yabridge to act as a bitbridge".

Why is there Bitbridge?
To allow you to use 32-bit plugins. :) You can't load 32-bit libraries in a 64-bit application or the other way around. So yabridge comes with both 32-bit and 64-bit host applications that can respectively load 32-bit and 64-bit Windows plugin libraries. And they both talk the same protocol as the native 64-bit plugin libraries, which is why you can seamlessly use both 32-bit and 64-bit Windows plugins.
At the moment I use yabridge 3.5 and as far as I know I don't have Bitbridge installed. However, I can use 32 bit VST's with yabridge.
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by robbert-vdh »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:53 pm
robbert-vdh wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:26 pm
Linuxmusician01 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:03 pm Thanks for the clarification.

However, I still have one question. On the Yabridge website it says "Yabridge seamlessly supports using both 32-bit and 64-bit [...] plugins". But there's also Bitbridge as a part of YABridge. And Bitbridge "It is also possible to compile a host application for yabridge that's compatible with 32-bit plugins such as old SynthEdit plugins. This will allow yabridge to act as a bitbridge".

Why is there Bitbridge?
To allow you to use 32-bit plugins. :) You can't load 32-bit libraries in a 64-bit application or the other way around. So yabridge comes with both 32-bit and 64-bit host applications that can respectively load 32-bit and 64-bit Windows plugin libraries. And they both talk the same protocol as the native 64-bit plugin libraries, which is why you can seamlessly use both 32-bit and 64-bit Windows plugins.
At the moment I use yabridge 3.5 and as far as I know I don't have Bitbridge installed. However, I can use 32 bit VST's with yabridge.
You do have the bitbridge installed, unless you compiled it yourself and didn't specify the -Dbitbridge=true build option. Look for yabridge-host-32.exe.
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by glowrak guy »

More simplifications, ingenuity, and common sense. Wish you worked for Native Instruments! Well, almost. :wink:
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

robbert-vdh wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 2:04 pm You do have the bitbridge installed, unless you compiled it yourself and didn't specify the -Dbitbridge=true build option. Look for yabridge-host-32.exe.
Aha! You bet I have yabridge-host-32.exe. Didn't know that was, in fact, bitbridge. Thank you for clearing that up. :)
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[ANN] yabridge 4.0.1

Post by robbert-vdh »

This is a very small bugfix release to fix a (fairly rare) regression in yabridgectl's VST3 setup behavior from yabridge 4.0.0. The update also 'fixes' an issue with very recent Arturia VST3 plugins crashing during plugin scans in REAPER and Ardour. I wasn't able to reproduce these crashes up until now using the demo versions of the plugins, but I grabbed the currently free Analog Lab Intro version yesterday and was finally able to reproduce the issue. As I already expected, the plugin would try to use globals without checking whether those globals were initialized, right after the plugin deinitialized those globals. Preventing that allows the plugin scan to succeed again.

If you missed it, then you you may want to check out the above. The the full changelog for this release can be found here:

https://github.com/robbert-vdh/yabridge ... /tag/4.0.1
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0.1, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by funkmuscle »

This is why I've always said that if anyone is using Windows VSTs to use it and commit that track ASAP because a Wine or Yabridge upgrade can mess things up.
PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS THE WRONG WAY. I'm just saying to help folks out so they're not stuck because a project is now being held up due to something going wrong. Actually that thought should be applied no matter what IMHO.

That being said, since the upgrade to 4.0.1, wine host won't start.

Code: Select all

yabridgectl sync

works fine. 4.0.0 worked great but now, even after downgrading back to 4.0.0, the wine host failed.
I'm using ArchLinux. I only use MT-Powerkit and ssd5 just to get the midi files to construct a song then I use DrumGizmo for the song.

I will try a few troubleshooting things here and will get back.

Thanks for the awesome app BTW


Ok so I've downgraded wine-staging also, yabridgectl sync worked but still failure.
This is the output when running Reaper in terminal and before downgrading wine-staging

Code: Select all

$ reaper
jack: created client
jack: setting TIME_CRITICAL = 4
LC_NUMERIC / LANG is set to 'en_CA.UTF-8', overriding LC_NUMERIC environment to POSIX
jack: activated client
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] Initializing yabridge version 3.8.1
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] host:          '/usr/bin/yabridge-host.exe'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] plugin:        '/usr/lib/vst/MT-PowerDrumKit.dll'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] plugin type:   'VST2'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] realtime:      'yes'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] sockets:       '/run/user/1000/yabridge-MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] wine prefix:   '<default>'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] wine version:  '7.10 (Staging)'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] 
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] config from:   '<defaults>'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] hosting mode:  'individually, 64-bit'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] other options: '<none>'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] 
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] Enabled features:
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] - bitbridge support
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] - VST3 support
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] 
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] 002c:fixme:winediag:LdrInitializeThunk wine-staging 7.10 is a testing version containing experimental patches.
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] 002c:fixme:winediag:LdrInitializeThunk Please mention your exact version when filing bug reports on winehq.org.
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] Initializing yabridge host version 4.0.0
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] Preparing to load VST2 plugin at '/usr/lib/vst/MT-PowerDrumKit.dll'
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] Error while initializing the Wine plugin host:
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] connect: No such file or directory
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] The Wine host process has exited unexpectedly. Check the output above for more information.
terminate called without an active exception
Aborted (core dumped)
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0.1, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by robbert-vdh »

funkmuscle wrote: Sun Jun 12, 2022 7:49 pm This is why I've always said that if anyone is using Windows VSTs to use it and commit that track ASAP because a Wine or Yabridge upgrade can mess things up.
PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS THE WRONG WAY. I'm just saying to help folks out so they're not stuck because a project is now being held up due to something going wrong. Actually that thought should be applied no matter what IMHO.

That being said, since the upgrade to 4.0.1, wine host won't start.

Code: Select all

yabridgectl sync

works fine. 4.0.0 worked great but now, even after downgrading back to 4.0.0, the wine host failed.
I'm using ArchLinux. I only use MT-Powerkit and ssd5 just to get the midi files to construct a song then I use DrumGizmo for the song.

I will try a few troubleshooting things here and will get back.

Thanks for the awesome app BTW


Ok so I've downgraded wine-staging also, yabridgectl sync worked but still failure.
This is the output when running Reaper in terminal and before downgrading wine-staging

Code: Select all

$ reaper
jack: created client
jack: setting TIME_CRITICAL = 4
LC_NUMERIC / LANG is set to 'en_CA.UTF-8', overriding LC_NUMERIC environment to POSIX
jack: activated client
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] Initializing yabridge version 3.8.1
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] host:          '/usr/bin/yabridge-host.exe'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] plugin:        '/usr/lib/vst/MT-PowerDrumKit.dll'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] plugin type:   'VST2'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] realtime:      'yes'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] sockets:       '/run/user/1000/yabridge-MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] wine prefix:   '<default>'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] wine version:  '7.10 (Staging)'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] 
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] config from:   '<defaults>'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] hosting mode:  'individually, 64-bit'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] other options: '<none>'
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] 
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] Enabled features:
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] - bitbridge support
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] - VST3 support
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] 
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] 002c:fixme:winediag:LdrInitializeThunk wine-staging 7.10 is a testing version containing experimental patches.
15:59:45 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] 002c:fixme:winediag:LdrInitializeThunk Please mention your exact version when filing bug reports on winehq.org.
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] Initializing yabridge host version 4.0.0
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] Preparing to load VST2 plugin at '/usr/lib/vst/MT-PowerDrumKit.dll'
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] Error while initializing the Wine plugin host:
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] [Wine STDERR] connect: No such file or directory
15:59:46 [MT-PowerDrumKit-CDFKRXeg] The Wine host process has exited unexpectedly. Check the output above for more information.
terminate called without an active exception
Aborted (core dumped)
Look at the log, you're loading an old yabridge 3.8.1 plugin. I put the 'read the the first bullet under the yabridgectl section of the changelog' in bold for a reason. ;) When you ran `yabridgectl sync` yabridgectl will have warned out about a bunch of orphan files that shouldn't be there. You forgot to rerun the command with the --prune option to remove those. If yabridgectl complains about or warns you about something, it's usually for a good reason.
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0.1, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by funkmuscle »

Yes I saw that when you stressed to read the read me section but when it updated in Arch as I said 4.0.0 worked and it's just today with the 4.0.1 is where I got the failure. All day yesterday I was using it to get some drum tracks from SSD 5. And the sink option did not give me any error messages. I'm used to seeing the error messages so I know what you're talking about but I didn't see anything like that in fact I would sometimes get an error message in the color red but that has been gone since 4.0.0.

Okay instead of me justifying my idiotic side here :mrgreen: Let me give it a shot and see if that fixes things. Thanks again man!

Okay I did everything including the --prune but I did not uninstall the app and it still showing as version 3.8.0 even though I just installed 4.0.1 so do you think I have to start all over by uninstalling and reinstalling stuff? Well Yabridge
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Re: [ANN] yabridge 4.0.1, with chainloading, an overhauled backend, and many user experience improvements

Post by funkmuscle »

I think this is going to be a complete overhaul for me. I've completely uninstalled the app and then reinstall but it's still showing 3.8 so I may have to go in manually to all of these directories where it's still showing up or wherever I see Yabridge and remove it because it's loading some windows VST but it just happens to be the ones I just installed to see if they would work but I don't ever use them to what I said previously that if I don't commit the track and something like this happens I'm screwed and that's why I never ever use non-linux plugins to stay in my mix. I'll always commit but that's my problem anyhow but I'm going to just remove anything that I see that says Yabridge and do a complete clean installation and I'll get back to you to let you know and to let others know that do not follow my path of stupidity. My wife is currently laughing right now because she's saying eventually one day you will not throw away the manual or the instructions and you'll decide to read it so you don't give yourself a headache :mrgreen:
Thanks again man and I hope my stupidity actually helps someone so I'll keep you posted
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