LinuxMusicians

42low wrote:

finotti wrote:(When I started, it also did not import tempo/time signatures. Now it does.)

Didn't try this yet, but to me it would be a problem.
IMO the imported track should follow the ardour-project tempo/time as it is meant to fit in that.

Well, if you want to import a MIDI file that you (or someone else) created with lots of changes, it would be a pain to manually enter them all.

BUT, it is an option when importing. You can still import without tempo/time signature.

42low wrote:

finotti wrote:First, you cannot export a MIDI file. You can find the midi files in "interchange/<project name>/midifiles/", but it is a bit inconvenient.

I can.
Select the midi part within the track, then right-click the mouse, and under the trackname (most above) you can find 'export track' which exports a midi file.

Thanks, that's good to know, but copying the MIDI files is pretty easy too. But it would be nice if you could export a single MIDI with all (or selected) MIDI tracks. But indeed, no big deal.

Linuxmusician01 wrote:

finotti wrote:[...]
So, I went with Ardour. It was actually not bad at all working with it, but it had a few problems.
[...]
Second, the two already mentioned bugs are quite annoying. If you put in two notes (even different notes), one starting right after the other (even using grid, to make sure there is no overlap), often the second note does not play. (This would be more natural for the same note, as MIDI cannot play overlapping equal notes...) The fix is to make the first note a little shorter. Besides being annoying to fix it, the fix makes the score all messed up.

The other bug is the note that keeps playing. If your note ends right at the end of a MIDI region, Ardour might not register the end of the note and keep playing it. The fix is to either extend the region a little or to shorten the note.

Is that seriously so?? That makes Ardour unusable. They ask money from Windows users for this stuff. If above mentioned bugs are in Ardour then they should be unbelievably ashamed!

Well, it was my experience, but to be clear, it is not all the time that it happens (which makes it even weirder). But it may sound worse to fix it than it actually is: you can select the whole region you've created, change the grid to something like beat/64, and reduce all the notes in the region by beat/64. That fixes the problems and it is not noticeable (unless the beat is slow, I guess).

I must say, though, that I love Ardour. It has some crashes every once in a while, but I think it is a great piece of software, well deserving of a donation. But I do think that MIDI (which seems to have low priority with Ardour, perhaps understandably, as there options for creating MIDI tracks) does deserve some attention.

j_e_f_f_g wrote:

finotti wrote:Muse crashed with a "segmentation fault"

Muse 2.x wants to be run with admin priviledges. I open a terminal window and do "sudo muse", and then it doesn't crash.

Ah, I did not know that. Thanks! Although it is a huge security risk...

Linuxmusician01 wrote:

42low wrote:

Linuxmusician01 wrote:That makes Ardour unusable. They ask money from swodnew users for this stuff. If above mentioned bugs are in Ardour then they should be unbelievably ashamed!

Uuuhhhmmm. Even if ardour would work perfectly, it would perhaps even still crash wouldn't it?
But who bothers when using linux. Nice subject for non-linux forums.

To me, even with some bugs (i simply don't use then) Ardour with it's many great good working features and options is my personal favorit.

I want to use my DAW w/ VST's of my favourite synths (Synth1). They need to be programmed w/ Midi notes. If Ardour can't do that, that's pretty serious drawback isn't it? I have no interest in learning how to use Ardour now.

Although that is understandable. especially if all you want is to create MIDI files, keep in mind that Ardour is really great for mixing/recording. If you want to do that, it might be worth learning. Just do the MIDI in some other software (if the fix is too inconvenient). But, fortunately, there are options, like QTractor (I will open a thread to see if I can fix my no-sound-problem soon), or paid ones, like Reason (native). At the end of the day, you choose the best tool that works for you. It's nice we have options!

Yeah the pesky hanging note in Ardour.
Well if you just extend the end of the midi region the note won't hang.
Also Ardour charges for compilation basically. So windows users can get ardour for free if they compile themselves.

I've done numerous projects with only midi in Ardour so it does work fine.

Also made one synth project with Qtractor to see if it would suit me better and ironically this was was the first time I won a prize in the One Synth Challenge.

Never got Muse to work, it doesn't like the jack supplied by kxstudio it seems. I'm not gonna run it as root and neither should you

rncbc wrote:

Linuxmusician01 wrote:Qtractor can only record one track at the time.

False! qtractor can record as many tracks, audio and/or MIDI, simultaneously, as long as there are many audio input buses/channels available.

cheers

That's weird. I'm not very experienced w/ DAW's but I was under the impression that, for simultaneously recording of multiple tracks, one needs to connect in- and out-ports in Jack. One also needs an external audio device like the Behringer UMC1820 (see this Ardour forum topic) that can "forward" more than 2 channels (stereo) to your computer. Jack reports multiple out ports then like so:


I thought that one must connect, for instance, 4 of those capture output ports to separate input ports from, for instance, Qtractor or Ardour. When I create multiple audio tracks in Ardour then they show up in Jack as separate input ports, like so:


However, if I create multiple audio tracks in QTractor they do not show up as separate input ports in Jack:



You see? Eventhough I made more than one audio track in Qtractor, Jack only shows the Left and Right channels of stereo (master in 1 & 2). It does not show every Qtractor track as a separate input. I can only record the same audio to all tracks at once whereas in Ardour I can simultaneously record the guitarist to track 1, the bass player to track 2, the synth player to track 3, the singer to track 4, etc. Not one by one, but all four of them at the same time, each on it's own track.

In qtractor tracks record via a bus.

You'll need to add extra busses in order to get extra inputs for tracks.
Add busses; use track properties to assign a bus to a track.

Very different workflow from Ardour but the same results are achievable.

rghvdberg wrote:In qtractor tracks record via a bus.

You'll need to add extra busses in order to get extra inputs for tracks.
Add busses; use track properties to assign a bus to a track.

Very different workflow from Ardour but the same results are achievable.

Thank you for the help. How do I add busses in Qtractor? In the 'Busses' dialog window (pull-down menu: "View --> Busses") there is no option to add busses.

Linuxmusician01 wrote:How do I add busses in Qtractor? In the 'Busses' dialog window (pull-down menu: "View --> Busses") there is no option to add busses.

classic!
1. select an existing bus;
2. change one or its properties, obviously the name for a brand new bus;
3. et voilá, the "Create" button is lit
hth.
cheers

rncbc wrote:

Linuxmusician01 wrote:How do I add busses in Qtractor? In the 'Busses' dialog window (pull-down menu: "View --> Busses") there is no option to add busses.

classic!
1. select an existing bus;
2. change one or its properties, obviously the name for a brand new bus;
3. et voilá, the "Create" button is lit
hth.
cheers

Thank you very much, man! That way the added busses show up in Jack too, btw. Guess that QTractor is it for me then. Wouldn't know what it does not have that others do. Just like some others on this forum I was hesitating to dig into the manual of yet another DAW. I started w/ LMMS. Only to discover that you cannot record live audio w/ it (i.e. no guitar to accompany your VST drum etc.). Then I discovered that some DAW's cannot record muliple tracks at one (Audacity).

Oh, wait a minute. I can see one drawback of Qtractor. I can not see the presets of a VST instrument the way that I do see them in LMMS. Well, guess that I have to come up w/ my own patches then... Tickles my creativity.

Linuxmusician01 wrote:Oh, wait a minute. I can see one drawback of Qtractor. I can not see the presets of a VST instrument the way that I do see them in LMMS. Well, guess that I have to come up w/ my own patches then... Tickles my creativity.

not true, again not immediately obvious:
a) native VST presets you access via its own GUI (plugin/Edit...);
b) otherwise, you can have FXP/FXB preset file support only from the generic UI (plugin/Properties...).
c) in case you're confusing presets with programs, one VST preset may provide one or more MIDI instrument programs, that you then may select via MIDI bank_select/program_change standard messages or via the MIDI Track/Properties... dialog (instrument, bank, program fields);
hth.
cheers

rncbc wrote:

Linuxmusician01 wrote:Oh, wait a minute. I can see one drawback of Qtractor. I can not see the presets of a VST instrument the way that I do see them in LMMS. Well, guess that I have to come up w/ my own patches then... Tickles my creativity.

not true, again not immediately obvious:
a) native VST presets you access via its own GUI (plugin/Edit...);
b) otherwise, you can have FXP/FXB preset file support only from the generic UI (plugin/Properties...).
c) in case you're confusing presets with programs, one VST preset may provide one or more MIDI instrument programs, that you then may select via MIDI bank_select/program_change standard messages or via the MIDI Track/Properties... dialog (instrument, bank, program fields);
hth.
cheers

[probably off topic, sorry people] I can't help myself for stealing this topic and asking questions 'bout QTractor. My apologies (might start a separate topic).

@Rncbc: thank you again for the info. I can't seem to be able to find the presets in Qtractor that I can find in Lmms. Here's what I mean. In Lmms the presets of a VSTi (CY_Freemoog in my screenshots) can be accessed by clicking on the little black button w/ the "down arrow" above the keyboard on the right hand side of the Vestige dialog window. What you see in LMMS then is:

(click thumbnail for larger image)

I do not know how to access these presets of the same VSTi in QTractor. What I see in Qtractor is:

(click thumbnail for larger image)

Linuxmusician01 wrote:I do not know how to access these presets of the same VSTi in QTractor.

1) double click on the MIDI track on the left pane or hit main menu Track > Track Properties...
2) select the VSTi plugin name as the MIDI track's Instrument name;
3) select one or the only one bank there probably is (Bank 0);
4) select the program from the next drop-down list which might resemble the list from LMMS (in fact these are programs not presets; if LMMS call it presets then they are wrong).
ps. you can also select the current selected program from the main menu or track right-click cotnext-menu Track > Instrument > (plugin-name) > Bank 0 > (program-list)
byee

@Rncbc: thanks again! Problem solved. I added an 'audio' track instead of a 'midi' track.

I'm not a heavy midi user, but I still often need midi, and I haven't found my ideal love yet. LMMS is a fun to use all in one app and offers a great creativity to work ratio as long you stay within it's paradigm of sequenced music in DJ quality. If Linux audio found its way back to modularity*, the LMMS piano roll is a GUI I would like to use from other DAWs. The only other midi capable DAW I have spent much time on is Ardour, and although it is plain that midi playback and editing are not it's strengths, I'll probably stick to it for some more time, if only for the convenience of having everything in one project. Which anyway doesn't happen, because I don't want to miss Hydrogen, both as a pattern based editor and an instrument, the DrMr plugin just isn't a full substitute, and also unfortunately exporting Hydrogen's song midi to Ardour and triggering Hydrogen as a drum sampler with that, didn't give me the same exactitude as leaving the song in Hydrogen's sequencer and syncing it to Ardour.
It was in that (non-conclusive) endeavor of looking for a Hydrogen-friendly candidate to host the midi side of my projects in the future, that I made a quick round of Muse, Rosegarden, Qtractor, Non-Sequencer and whatever else had come with my distro's install medium. The interesting detail I wanted to share in this post, is that only Rosegarden was able to show the percussion instrument names associated with each key after importing a Hydrogen - originated midi track, proof that such information is embedded in .mid files and other DAWs miss it.

*related: does my memory cheat me, or did Ardour once have an 'open in external editor' option?

forestandgarden wrote:...only Rosegarden was able to show the percussion instrument names associated with each key after importing a Hydrogen - originated midi track, proof that such information is embedded in .mid files and other DAWs miss it.

not true. drum/key names are NOT stored in .mid files whatsoever.

what you're probably seeing is good old standard GM percussion/drum map, often applied to MIDI channel 10, something that qtractor also does, even better if you set a proper instrument definition on the designated MIDI track.

instrument definitions are configured according to instrument definition files, eg. *.midnam files, which provide designated percussion/drum key names specific for the target instrument module.

both qtractor and ardour accept *.midnam files for the very purpose at hand, while the former also reads from *.ins (old cakewalk instrument definitions) files and *.sf2 as well.

hth.
cheers