pw-jack

[Impostor]

So as not to delay the inevitable, I've installed Mint 22 which uses Pipewire ootb. I needed to install pipewire-jack manually, and create a pipewire group to add myself to. Default samplerate seems 48kHz, so that's fine, but default buffer size was 1024, so changed that to 128. So far so good.

Problem is, I seem to need to run every jack application from a terminal with

Code: Select all

pw-jack <application> 

otherwise the application senses that jack is not available and throws errors (MusE, Qtractor, Pianoteq).

Am I missing something or is that indeed the way to run Jack apps with Pipewire?

From https://docs.pipewire.org/page_man_pw-jack_1.html:
"If PipeWire's reimplementation of the JACK client libraries has been installed as a system-wide replacement for JACK's own libraries, then the whole system already behaves in that way, in which case pw-jack has no practical effect."

So the question becomes: how to accomplish "PipeWire's reimplementation of the JACK client libraries has been installed as a system-wide replacement for JACK's own libraries" on a system where pipewire is installed ootb??

[sysrqer]

You used to have to do some kind of symlinking thing and used to be detailed here https://pipewire-debian.github.io/pipewire-debian/ but it seems it's not now, this was quite a few years ago so I'm surprised you would need to but perhaps you're running a very old version if it's mint. Might be a good idea to use that, or another PPA to get a newer version of pipewire and wireplumber.

There is something like this mentioned in the debian docs https://wiki.debian.org/PipeWire#JACK but I can't remember that that's the same thing I'm thinking of. Also mentioned in the void linux docs https://docs.voidlinux.org/config/media/pipewire.html

[Impostor]

You used to have to do some kind of symlinking thing

I looked up the location of pipewire-jack's library files. They were installed in

/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/pipewire-0.3/jack

But..I also had equivalent library files in

/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/

with the difference that in the upper folder libjack.so is linked to libjack.so.0.3.1005
and in the lower folder libjack.so was linked to libjack.so.0.1.something.

So I just deleted the files in the lower folder, and copied the files from the upper into the lower folder, and behold: it works correctly now (I did a sudo ldconfig for good measure).

I guess the Mint packagers didn't test with Jack applications first..

[sysrqer]

I guess the Mint packagers didn't test with Jack applications first..

Which version of pw do you have? I wonder if it's less of a packaging thing and more of a very early pipewire thing.

[Impostor]

I guess the Mint packagers didn't test with Jack applications first..

Which version of pw do you have? I wonder if it's less of a packaging thing and more of a very early pipewire thing.

Code: Select all

$ pipewire --version
pipewire
Compiled with libpipewire 1.0.5
Linked with libpipewire 1.0.5

So I guess version 1.0.5. Although it's rather suspicious that pipewire-jack (also given as version 1.0.5 in Synaptic), puts its libraries in a pipewire-0.3 folder...

And the plot thickens: no installed package with pipewire in the name did install those libjack.so and related files into /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/, as far as I can determine in Synaptic. And the pipewire-jack package installed them exclusively in /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/pipewire-0.3/jack/.

This is a clean installation of Mint 22 by the way, so they are no leftovers from a previous install.

[sysrqer]

Interesting. Yeah that's what caught my attention but I've just checked and I also have it on Arch (although not the jack part) so must be normal.

[Impostor]

And the plot thickens: no installed package with pipewire in the name did install those libjack.so and related files into /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/, as far as I can determine in Synaptic. And the pipewire-jack package installed them exclusively in /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/pipewire-0.3/jack/.
This is a clean installation of Mint 22 by the way, so they are no leftovers from a previous install.

Ah, I found out where those original files came from. I built MusE from source, and one dependency to build was libjack-jackd2-dev, which pulled in libjack-jackd2-0, which in turn installed those libraries. Guess I have to be more careful..

[Impostor]

One other thing I had to manually set is:
@pipewire - memlock unlimited

instead of some default value, in /etc/security/limits.d/25-pw-rlimits.conf, because with the default I couldn't load more than 7 instances of Pianoteq without crashing MusE.

[Largos]

I found the same needs to be done with MX Linux but I don't need to (and never needed to) use the pw-jack prefix on OpenSuse. So I would presume it's a debian thing. It's easiest to edit menu entries to put the prefix in commands. Or if you use the terminal, put some bashrc alias in.

[GMaq]

Lol,

You're giving me a deja-vu... I had to do all that stuff for AV Linux plus add a custom metadata tool, PipeWire is a pretty abrupt stop to use for Pro Audio, many big mainstream Distros have no idea what's needed...

If you have a multi-i/o interface your next hurdle will be to assign a "Pro Audio" profile to it with PulseAudio Volume Control so it is not seen as a surround device..

[Impostor]

Next thing I need to figure out is if I need a jack.conf in addition to a pipewire.conf file

https://docs.pipewire.org/page_man_pipe ... onf_5.html

I may need to sleep on that.

[sysrqer]

If you have a multi-i/o interface your next hurdle will be to assign a "Pro Audio profile to it with PulseAudio Volume Control so it is not seen as a surround device..

Is that really a hurdle? On my system it that was literally a drop down menu in the audio settings. Definitely a good tip though.

[LAM]

Next thing I need to figure out is if I need a jack.conf in addition to a pipewire.conf file

https://docs.pipewire.org/page_man_pipe ... onf_5.html

I may need to sleep on that.

It depends.
For example, if you want to control the realtime priority (rt.prio) or the minimum buffersize/samplerate (node.latency) of JACK applications or name your ports like good old JACK (jack.default-as-system), then yes.

[GMaq]

If you have a multi-i/o interface your next hurdle will be to assign a "Pro Audio profile to it with PulseAudio Volume Control so it is not seen as a surround device..

Is that really a hurdle? On my system it that was literally a drop down menu in the audio settings. Definitely a good tip though.

Well, yes for me it was, I was extremely puzzled why my Presonus AR-8 was suddenly a surround device and I've had it come up more than a few times with AVL Users... How is it intuitive for people to know that a 'PulseAudio' Pro Audio profile exists at all (wait, what? Didn't we replace 'PulseAudio' on the system...?) if they've just either installed PipeWire as the Distro packaging provides it, or installed a fresh Distro without pw-jack or PulseAudio Volume control? In my experience pavucontrol is not a dependency of PipeWire so it is quite easy to end up with a PW system with no pavucontrol and then it's really confusing.

My point isn't old guy moaning that PipeWire sucks, I'm well past that...lol. But this thread demonstrates that on a huge mainstream Distro even someone well versed with Pro Audio work can be stymied pretty quickly by the incomplete state that PipeWire arrives in.

[sunrat]

I've been wondering why we need pavucontrol to set profile in PW too. From a post at reddit this was suggested:

Put something like:

Code: Select all

monitor.alsa.rules = [
  {
    matches = [
      {
        node.name = "YOUR_DEVICE_NAME_AS_SHOWN_BY_'wpctl status'"
      }
    ]
    actions = {
      update-props = {
        device.profile = "pro-audio"
      }
    }
  }
]

in

~/.config/wireplumber/wireplumber.conf.d/51-set-profile.conf

I can't test it as I don't have a "Pro Audio" sound card.
Note also from Pipewire FAQ section on the Pro Audio profile:

This profile is meant to be used on audio cards with:

Code: Select all

More than 8 channels for input or output. Channel assignment is probably wrong for these cards.
Cards with many instruments connected to each input. It makes sense to handle each channel as a separate unrelated stream.
Output Cards with many unrelated outputs, like speakers on the first 2 channels, headphones on the second channel-pair, additional speakers on the other channels.

For consumer cards with stereo or surround configurations, it does not make sense to use this Profile.