dspMixFX / Steinberg

[bebob99]

Hi folks,
some years ago I bought the Steinberg UR242 which I do like very much. But back then I was on Windows only and did not care about other options. Meanwhile I'm all Ubuntu Linux and I find it very annoying that a good part of the interface function is accessible only by software and carefully hidden behind the "dspMixFx" application for that it has no obvious replacement on Linux and which I'm unable to get running on Wine either.

It IS "class compatible", so I can "use" it without much troubles with "all channels visible". First on "Pulse", later on JACK and now on PipeWire.

But every Time I want to change some settings, like decoupling the mic inputs and mapping them to center for the headphone/monitoring output, or vice versa, pan two mics fully left and right for stereo recording - every time I have to run for a windows PC, install the drivers and recable the interface.

Or I keep an old Notebook or virtual Windows running to make this change.

I increasingly get really frustrated on this.

Does anybody know of some software that at least is able to change the elementary settings of this interface on Linux? I don't care about the DSP stuff.

Would "class compatible" mean that the "internal settings" are exposed through this and a suitable "class compatible control panel" could access them?

If I have to get rid of this thing, does anybody recommend some equally good replacement, that will not cost a fortune? I will at least need two mic inputs with a good pre-amp (CM3 mics are good but have a rather low sensitivity), one line-in. Lately I had the need to get a signal from an external mixer that offered just balanced XLR but we at least managed to get the headphone out into the line-in with reasonable quality. So if a new interface has more than two XLR in, it would not hurt.

I know of the "no software, all hardware" interfaces like the Behringer that should work without drivers. I do like (and need) the latency free monitoring as I mostly use it for practicing my instrument and even the slightest latency between backing, mic and direct sound drives me crazy.

But none of them seems to do any panning on the channels for the monitoring headphone. Is this something that just I seem to need?

The Steinberg interfaces have no coverage here, certainly for a good reason.

But really - how complicated can it be to port a windows GUI for the device settings to Linux?

[bluebell]

Did you try alsamixer or qasmixer? Maybe you are lucky and the interface exposes its mixer via ALSA.

[bebob99]

Did you try alsamixer or qasmixer? Maybe you are lucky and the interface exposes its mixer via ALSA.

Yes. Both show plain nothing: "This device has no controls".

When I select the onboard sound chip, it is filled with sliders.

I just do not know whether this is to be expected as "class compliant" generally does not offer such features, or whether it's just this device that is not "class compliant" enough to expose this, or alsamixer is not class compliant enough to deal with it.

Does anybody get better results with different USB interfaces?

---

Meanwhile i got hands on the official "USB Device Class Definition for Audio Devices" Release 1.0 from 1998(!) This 130 page document describes almost everything you might want to know about audio processing and how it is to be signaled in USB protocol. And quite a number of things you never thought about. It's not only number of port or how to transport the audio stream. It's also all kind of mixing, processing, channel-synchronizing, feature selection, status signaling, copy protection ... that is defined in this "class paper".

Usually, you find valuable information on the internet like "Class 2.0 allows for more sampling resolution than Class 1.0" - and "that's the difference". But this specification defines a ton more than that and I assume only a tiny fraction of it is meant when someone states that a device or software is "class compliant". Just being recognized as audio device does probably not mean you can rely on anything more than the most basic 5% of this specification.

That makes me wonder whether there is some possibility to probe a "class compliant device" about the supported parts of this class. The Linux kernel or even Windows must do just that, so there might exist some program or command to get all those detailed listed.

[bluebell]

I am afraid that Class Compliance is only for playing and recording, not for internal functions. For an internal mixer there has to be some support in the Linux kernel. Geoffrey did a lot of work for Focusrite Scarletts and Claretts. If you need more than a couple of inputs/outputs the Scarlett 18i20 is supported well, both from the kernel and with the tool alsa-scarlett-gui.

[geoffrey]

But really - how complicated can it be to port a windows GUI for the device settings to Linux?

It can be pretty complicated. Trust me on that one!

If I have to get rid of this thing, does anybody recommend some equally good replacement, that will not cost a fortune? I will at least need two mic inputs with a good pre-amp (CM3 mics are good but have a rather low sensitivity), one line-in. Lately I had the need to get a signal from an external mixer that offered just balanced XLR but we at least managed to get the headphone out into the line-in with reasonable quality. So if a new interface has more than two XLR in, it would not hurt.

The Scarlett 3rd or 4th Gen 4i4 fits the bill. 2 combo (line/mic inputs) plus 2 more balanced line inputs (not XLR; use an adapter). 4 line outputs, 1 headphone output (shared on the 3rd Gen, independent on the 4th Gen). The 4th Gen 4i4 has more gain range on the mic preamp than the 3rd Gen 4i4; I've not measured, but at max gain my mic sounds louder in the 4th Gen.

The Linux software for controlling the 4th Gen 4i4 is working perfectly for me. Arbitrary mixing and routing between the physical and USB inputs and outputs.

If you only need two inputs at a time, then the 2i2 will also work for you, and there's a button on the front for toggling between no monitor, mono monitor, or stereo monitor. And Linux software to redefine the mono & stereo monitor mixes is coming soon too.

[bebob99]

The Linux software for controlling the 4th Gen 4i4 is working perfectly for me. Arbitrary mixing and routing between the physical and USB inputs and outputs.

So that sounds promising.

Meanwhile I tried again with WINE and now at least the software starts up. But it dos not find the interface. It obviously relies on some feature not translated by WINE or the USB interface is locked by the system. I think, if anybody had been able to get it working, we would know it by now.

[geoffrey]

Meanwhile I tried again with WINE and now at least the software starts up. But it dos not find the interface. It obviously relies on some feature not translated by WINE or the USB interface is locked by the system. I think, if anybody had been able to get it working, we would know it by now.

I never had success with Wine talking vendor-specific protocols to hardware. KVM with USB Device Redirection is way more likely to work for your sort of use case. Have you tried that? It's not exactly convenient to fire up a Windows VM to adjust settings but it's more convenient than a second computer and recabling.

[bebob99]

It's not exactly convenient to fire up a Windows VM to adjust settings but it's more convenient than a second computer and recabling.

Yes, I tried and it "works". However, my Linux does not like if I redirect the USB port to a VM. Most of the time it refuses to adopt it again correctly, when I close the VM. Sometimes it is enough to power off/on the interface, sometimes I have to reboot the machine to get it working again.

And I still have to keep a Windows license running, occupying a couple of Gigabytes on my SSD for no other use.

No, that's not "convenient".

I have been on Windows since V1.0 (and before). I finally switched (on the third try) to Linux BECAUSE I had troubles recording our concerts with a Windows PC. I always had the risk of latency problems, dropouts and even crashes. Me was told

Use Linux. It's more complicated to set up, but then you have more control about every aspect and no more dropouts. JACK is way better than anything on Windows.

Meanwhile I'm mostly convinced and additionally get increasingly pissed off the way Windows is heading. So I found a new Home on Linux. But after all these years it exists it's still some kind of Freak-Show for people who are dreaming in long and cryptic command line interfaces. It is still not considered an operating system for "real work" by most software companies.

I'm getting older too and I prefer things that "just work" more each day. Especially if they STAY that way, once they work. But since the entropy in the universe has to increase steadily, resulting in an ever degrading usability, even if you "don't change anything", I probably have to keep struggling.