Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

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yama
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Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

Hi, I'm on arch linux, currently using jack.

The mic is recognized by the system, I can use it on discord just fine. But on bitwig, my main DAW, it does not show up as an option to add as input bus.

I have tried switching to pipewire, and it actually solves this particular issue, but it causes others instead (constant crashes, clipping, the mic is no longer recognized by discord).

I'm not sure how to go about troubleshooting this.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by tseaver »

My guess would be that the H1N is not the interface Jack is managing: it likely grabs the onboard soundcard of your motherboard by default. Discord likely finds the mic (which has a built-in USB interface) via PulseAudio. Can you run QJackCtl and look to see what interface it thinks Jack is using?

Ubuntu, Mixbus32C; acoustic blues / country / jazz
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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by glowrak guy »

The Reaper-linux forum has some experienced helpful Arch users, might be lucky
to ask there as well. I have a Microsoft headphone/mic combo, and both parts work in Reaper,
listed right in qjackctl.

Bitwig might require a rather large wipeboard to draw out it's i/o routings :wink:
Hope you find success!

https://forum.cockos.com/forumdisplay.php?f=52

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

What @tseaver said. And my two cents. If you want to use Jackaudio and you're sure that your DAW of choice is configured to use Jack then before starting Jack you must determine the number of your audio device. I do that like this:

Code: Select all

cat /proc/asound/cards

Example of output:

Code: Select all

 0 [CMI8738        ]: CMI8738-MC6 - C-Media CMI8738
                      C-Media CMI8738 (model 55) at 0xd000, irq 20
 1 [PCH            ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel PCH
                      HDA Intel PCH at 0xf7c10000 irq 31

So I have number 0 and 1. I start Jack for audio device 1 like this:

Code: Select all

jackd -d alsa --device hw:1

Want to start it for audio device 0 (the default audio device which is your on-board audio card) instead? Then replace hw:1 with hw:0.

Good luck w/ Linux music! :)

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

tseaver wrote: Fri Dec 09, 2022 3:56 am

My guess would be that the H1N is not the interface Jack is managing: it likely grabs the onboard soundcard of your motherboard by default. Discord likely finds the mic (which has a built-in USB interface) via PulseAudio. Can you run QJackCtl and look to see what interface it thinks Jack is using?

The interface on qjackctl is hw:PCH,0 ALC662 analog (hw:1,0).

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Sat Dec 10, 2022 11:35 am

What @tseaver said. And my two cents. If you want to use Jackaudio and you're sure that your DAW of choice is configured to use Jack then before starting Jack you must determine the number of your audio device. I do that like this:

Code: Select all

cat /proc/asound/cards

Example of output:

Code: Select all

 0 [CMI8738        ]: CMI8738-MC6 - C-Media CMI8738
                      C-Media CMI8738 (model 55) at 0xd000, irq 20
 1 [PCH            ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel PCH
                      HDA Intel PCH at 0xf7c10000 irq 31

So I have number 0 and 1. I start Jack for audio device 1 like this:

Code: Select all

jackd -d alsa --device hw:1

Want to start it for audio device 0 (the default audio device which is your on-board audio card) instead? Then replace hw:1 with hw:0.

Good luck w/ Linux music! :)

I am going through the interfaces via qjackctl instead of doing it the way you describe, but I'm not sure what I'm trying to achieve.

EDIT: Nevermind this last bit, I had to bridge pulseaudio to jack. However, the h1n issue with reaper/bitwig still remains.

On top of that I'm having another issue which is that some apps, like firefox, won't play videos/output any sound when jack is on. It's like the sound is being sent to another interface, and sometimes it even gets sent to the h1n speaker, which is really annoying.

I don't know what's going on but this started happening after I switched to pipewire and back.

Apparently when jack is on there are only 2 sinks, h1n and analog output. But analog output is not pushing sound through my speakers.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

yama wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:35 pm

I am going through the interfaces via qjackctl instead of doing it the way you describe, but I'm not sure what I'm trying to achieve.

I'm afraid that you may not understand how one uses an "audio server" like JackAudio. Jack is started for one specific "interface" (I think you mean audio device when you write "interface"). Like the Zoom H1N or the on-board audio card/audio device of your computrer.

Qjackctl is a utility that shows you how you've configured Jack after it is started for one specific "interface" (read: audio device). You can NOT use Qjackctl to "go through interfaces".

yama wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:35 pm

EDIT: Nevermind this last bit, I had to bridge pulseaudio to jack. However, the h1n issue with reaper/bitwig still remains.

Worry 'bout Pulseaudio (yet another audio server, just like Pipewire) later. One step at the time.

yama wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:35 pm

On top of that I'm having another issue which is that some apps, like firefox, won't play videos/output any sound when jack is on. It's like the sound is being sent to another interface, and sometimes it even gets sent to the h1n speaker, which is really annoying.

I don't know what's going on but this started happening after I switched to pipewire and back.

Preferably, one should not use more than one audio server at the time. Indeed, you can use more than one via a "bridge" or "sink" like you said. But that's for after you've managed to start Jack properly for the Zoom HiN.

yama wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 3:35 pm

Apparently when jack is on there are only 2 sinks, h1n and analog output. But analog output is not pushing sound through my speakers.

What you're describing is two different audio devices. One device is the Zoom H1N and the other your on-board audio card/chip. You can only use one piece of audio hardware at the time.

Other than "audio servers" there's also the "driver" for audio on Linux: ALSA. Luckily, there's only one driver. Unfortunately, there is more than one audio server on Linux. Why an audio server? Because ALSA can use only "serve" audio to one application at the time. So when you're using Firefox you can't get audio out of a media player for instance. There's:

  • JackAudio (version 1 and 2, not much difference between the two)

  • PulseAudio (so you can have audio in Firefox and Chrome)

  • PipeWire (replacement for the myriad of audio servers on Linux)

  • maybe more...?

To make things more confusing you can actually use more than one audio device with Pulse (you can choose between 'm with Pulseaudio's vulume unit control utility called pavucontrol), but not with Jack.

As long as one does not fully and completely understands the terms audio device, audio driver and audio server one had better not try set one up yet. Sorry, man.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:12 am

I'm afraid that you may not understand how one uses an "audio server" like JackAudio. Jack is started for one specific "interface" (I think you mean audio device when you write "interface"). Like the Zoom H1N or the on-board audio card/audio device of your computrer.

Qjackctl is a utility that shows you how you've configured Jack after it is started for one specific "interface" (read: audio device). You can NOT use Qjackctl to "go through interfaces".

Friend, qjackctl says "interface"

Image

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:12 am

What you're describing is two different audio devices. One device is the Zoom H1N and the other your on-board audio card/chip. You can only use one piece of audio hardware at the time.

I am not making up terminology, that is what they're called in pacmd. I don't understand the implication, are you saying I can't use my soundcard and the h1n as a microphone with jack? If that's the case then I'm jumping ship immediately because that's a glaring flaw in software meant for recording audio lol

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 10:12 am

As long as one does not fully and completely understands the terms audio device, audio driver and audio server one had better not try set one up yet. Sorry, man.

I appreciate you taking the time to type all this out but semantics is not very actionable as advice. What am I actually meant to do? If the answer to the previous question is no, then I don't have much choice but to pretty much reinstall arch and go with pipewire from the start.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

yama wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:39 pm

Friend, qjackctl says "interface"

Image

My apologies. Indeed, Qjackctl calls it an interface. However, one cannot change interface when Jack is already running. It's confusing, I admit. The Settings tab of Qjackctl that you show is to start Jack at the same time that one starts Qjackctl. I never do that (I start Jack via the command line and then run Qjackctl). So I was wrong about the terminology of Jack. But when you use Qjackctl then Jack's already started. So you can't change/switch interface (audio device) on the fly with Qjackctl. If you do you probably have to re-start your DAW. It's like stopping and starting the ASIO audio driver on Windows.

yama wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:39 pm

I am not making up terminology, that is what they're called in pacmd. I don't understand the implication, are you saying I can't use my soundcard and the h1n as a microphone with jack? If that's the case then I'm jumping ship immediately because that's a glaring flaw in software meant for recording audio lol

You cannot use two audio devices (interfaces)at the same time in a DAW in Windows or Apple either. Has to do with timing issues etc. of hardware. Each application (Firefox, Ardour etc.) uses one audio device at the time. So audio out via your sound card and microphone in at the same time is out of the question on a computer. You might be able to use 'm both, but - for instance - to record audio w/ the H1N microphone without hearing that audio through your speakers. And after that you can use your DAW to process that audio and listen to it via the other device, i.e. via your speakers. And that's the same in Linux, Windows and AppleOS. Most people record audio and monitor (i.e. listen) to it at the same time. I think you can't do that w/ your setup.

yama wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:39 pm

I appreciate you taking the time to type all this out but semantics is not very actionable as advice. What am I actually meant to do? If the answer to the previous question is no, then I don't have much choice but to pretty much reinstall arch and go with pipewire from the start.

What you are meant to do was in my firtst post. I.e. determine the number of the H1N and then start Jack via the command line. However, you chose not to do that. I'm trying to help. Believe me: it's the same on every operating system. You have to use the right audio device for the right application. Be it somewhat more confusing on Linux because of all the audio servers.

If I were you I'd determine the number of my audio device, then start Jack from the command line (not via Qjackctl) and then test if you can use it in your DAW of choice. After that you can determine how to start it all more simply, via Qjackctl.

I've got no experience w/ PipeWire (yet). And, like most computer users that make music/record audio, I use only one interface at the time.

Good luck.

P.S. You can also try to use your DAW without Jack. Most of 'm will work with PulseAudio (the audio server that gets started per default) or only ALSA (the bare audio driver). But you have to tell the DAW in its settings what to use: Jack, Pulse or bare ALSA.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by sunrat »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 8:34 pm

So I was wrong about the terminology of Jack. But when you use Qjackctl then Jack's already started. So you can't change/switch interface (audio device) on the fly with Qjackctl. If you do you probably have to re-start your DAW.

Qjackctl has Start/Stop buttons so it can do that. You're correct in that one needs to stop it to change parameters.

If I were you I'd determine the number of my audio device, then start Jack from the command line (not via Qjackctl) and then test if you can use it in your DAW of choice. After that you can determine how to start it all more simply, via Qjackctl.

Qjackctl can configure many things the same as command line JACK. It's just a graphical depiction of exactly the same thing.

P.S. You can also try to use your DAW without Jack. Most of 'm will work with PulseAudio (the audio server that gets started per default) or only ALSA (the bare audio driver). But you have to tell the DAW in its settings what to use: Jack, Pulse or bare ALSA.

Many applications won'r work with PulseAudio, but some like Ardour can work with straight ALSA if PA is stopped.
I use PA > JACK > ALSA so most things work.
You also said ALSA can't output multiple audio applications. It can with dmix, but the PulseAudio developers decided to make a whole new complicated mess to do that instead. There are reasons Pipewire is set to replace it, but that brings a whole new set of complications. :roll: :mrgreen:

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 8:34 pm

So audio out via your sound card and microphone in at the same time is out of the question on a computer.

I think your information is quite outdated, I can do this just fine with pipewire, so it's definitely not a OS-wide limitation, nor I suspect it would be a limitation on windows, though i haven't used windows in years.

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Mon Dec 12, 2022 8:34 pm

What you are meant to do was in my firtst post. I.e. determine the number of the H1N and then start Jack via the command line. However, you chose not to do that. I'm trying to help. Believe me: it's the same on every operating system. You have to use the right audio device for the right application. Be it somewhat more confusing on Linux because of all the audio servers.

I didn't "choose not to do that", I did it via qjackctl. When you change the interface and hit apply, it restarts jack. It didn't solve the issue. But still there's something I don't understand, if I did this, it would disable my soundcard as an active device? Meaning my speakers/headphones wouldn't output sound? Because I do not want that, it's not a solution, so please correct me if I misunderstood.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by Kott »

you can use different devices with jack https://jackaudio.org/faq/multiple_devices.html

or if you use qjackctl, go to advanced settings and select usb mic for input and onboard soundcard for output:

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

@everybody: then why doesn't it work yet? The link to Jack's web page explaining how to use two different audio devices clearly states that it is highly discouraged:

JackAudio's website wrote:

trying to use multiple independent soundcards is problematic

As everybody knows there are many ways to do the same thing on a computer. Usually the person who wants help follows the procedure of the helper because the helper then immediately knows what's the problem from his/her own experience. After solving the problem one can work on doing things better or in a way that suits the person needing help better. That is: I, for one, am not gonna start Jack from Qjackctl. When started from the command line I can deal better with errors, if any. That's also possible via Qjackctl but I've got no experience w/ that.

I cannot and will not try to understand why it is so hard to simply run the following command to determine if Jack's properly started:

Code: Select all

cat /proc/asound/cards

jackd -d alsa --device hw:1

I consider not doing that (takes 5 seconds) to be needlessly stubborn and trolling. Remember that the problem was:

yama wrote: Fri Dec 09, 2022 2:13 am

[...] currently using jack.

The mic is recognized by the system, I can use it on discord just fine. But on bitwig, my main DAW, it does not show up [...]

.
.
BTW No good deed goes unpunished; I unsubscribed from this topic. May make things more easy for y'all. No need for y'all to reply to or follow my advice.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Tue Dec 13, 2022 11:18 am

I consider not doing that (takes 5 seconds) to be needlessly stubborn and trolling. Remember that the problem was:

It's not trolling if it's not a solution. I just tested it to satisfy your ego, and the sound comes out of the h1n, which is obviously not want I want.

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Re: Zoom H1N not recognized as input by reaper or bitwig

Post by yama »

Kott wrote: Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:24 am

you can use different devices with jack https://jackaudio.org/faq/multiple_devices.html

or if you use qjackctl, go to advanced settings and select usb mic for input and onboard soundcard for output:

YES, this worked, my deepest thanks. I'm ashamed I didn't catch that by myself, but to be fair the warning steered me away.

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