Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Support & discussion regarding DAWs and MIDI sequencers.

Moderators: khz, MattKingUSA

What are your favourites?

Ardour/Harrison Mixbus
56
41%
LMMS
7
5%
Qtractor
17
13%
Rosegarden
6
4%
Tracktion Waveform
12
9%
Renoise
3
2%
Bitwig Studio
7
5%
Reaper
18
13%
Muse
4
3%
Other
5
4%
 
Total votes: 135

rhydermike
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby rhydermike » Wed Feb 20, 2019 1:52 pm

I like Ardour ever so much, but I'm not a regular user because of the incomplete MIDI functionality. As others have mentioned, the workflow can be a bit awkward when working with MIDI, but the bigger problem, for me, is the MIDI bugs. For example, there seems to be a big problem with stuck notes at the end of a region. I know that you can make the notes slightly shorter to work around this, but this just adds to the awkwardness of working with MIDI, for me.

It's a shame because it's a great program otherwise, and I know the devs are just as frustrated as the users about how long it's taking to finish the MIDI side of the program.

I've just upgraded to Tracktion Waveform 10, and I'll be using that for at least another year. They seem to have done more work on giving you pane at the bottom of the screen that pops up with MIDI notes in it, rather than having to fiddle with pop up windows.

Rosegarden is a good program, but a bit old-fashioned. It's also lacking on the audio side. Muse looked good as well, but I'm not sure what the workflow would be like compared to the pop out search bar for presets and plugins that Waveform has. Same with Qtractor.

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rncbc
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby rncbc » Wed Feb 20, 2019 3:37 pm

Death wrote:Qtractor is very cool though. I really like it and I think it's my favourite so far. I just have a couple of serious issues with that program which is why I haven't switched to it. The lack of PDC is a big deal for me. I also don't like the way that you can't make windows permanently stay on top of other windows - it disrupts my workflow too much. I spoke to the dev about it on this forum and it sounded like nothing would be done about these things anytime soon. Still, it'll stay there in my mind and I can imagine myself using it one day, or maybe switching to Ardour or Mixbus if the midi improves enough.


let there be noted that on the first account (PDC) is rather not a priority here; on the second one (always-on-top-level-windows) you should remember that it was (replied to you here in this forum) to be considered an option if given enough up votes (read tickets, issues,w/e).

after all, at the end of the day, this is about free, open-source, community driven software, no matter if it's just one dev (me) or a whole dang crowd: most of what qtractor is today, is and ever was provided by its users or fanboys (as some dare to say:) whomever input form, of which code is the most welcome of course, not a single dime has been involved whatsoever.

cheers

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bluebell
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby bluebell » Wed Feb 20, 2019 4:10 pm

rhydermike wrote:Rosegarden is a good program, but a bit old-fashioned. It's also lacking on the audio side.


It has audio tracks and can load LADSPA and DSSI plugins. It has subgroups. Though it has no effect sends you can record/arrange/mix audio, too. I used Rosegarden for some songs until I discovered Qtractor.

Rosegarden has plugin latency compensation, unfortunately only for MIDI-instrument-tracks. I guess few people use it for audio tracks, so the latency compensation was never included for audio tracks.
Linux – MOTU UltraLite AVB – Qtractor – https://soundcloud.com/suedwestlicht

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Linuxmusician01
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby Linuxmusician01 » Wed Feb 20, 2019 4:44 pm

rncbc wrote:
Death wrote:Qtractor is very cool though. I really like it and I think it's my favourite so far. I just have a couple of serious issues with that program which is why I haven't switched to it. The lack of PDC is a big deal for me. I also don't like the way that you can't make windows permanently stay on top of other windows - it disrupts my workflow too much. I spoke to the dev about it on this forum and it sounded like nothing would be done about these things anytime soon. Still, it'll stay there in my mind and I can imagine myself using it one day, or maybe switching to Ardour or Mixbus if the midi improves enough.


let there be noted that on the first account (PDC) is rather not a priority here; on the second one (always-on-top-level-windows) you should remember that it was (replied to you here in this forum) to be considered an option if given enough up votes (read tickets, issues,w/e).

after all, at the end of the day, this is about free, open-source, community driven software, no matter if it's just one dev (me) or a whole dang crowd: most of what qtractor is today, is and ever was provided by its users or fanboys (as some dare to say:) whomever input form, of which code is the most welcome of course, not a single dime has been involved whatsoever.

cheers

The windows that one can detach for the main Qtractor Window cannot be "put on top". However, one can put those windows inside the main window so you can see them all the time. Qtractor windows that cannot be incorporated inside the main window can be put on top via the right mouse button (like said: this is an option in almost any windows manager).

Automatic Plugin Delay Compensation (PDC) might be a nice feature to be added. I do not have a lot of experience w/ DAW's and Midi sequencers so: is this a big issue w/ DAW's? Are there a lot of plugins that have a considerable amount of delay? Can you name one?

(Qrtactor is the only DAW I've used. I dropped LMMS very soon after I noticed that it is not suited (enough) for audio as opposed to Midi)

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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby jonetsu » Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:26 pm

tavasti wrote:
Death wrote:
jonetsu wrote:This is why I use Mixbus32C for mixing: great sound. And Bitwig for creating: great (MIDI/Audio) flexibility for expressing ideas.


I haven't tried 32c. Is the sound really much better than the regular version?


https://mixbus.helpscoutdocs.com/articl ... mixbus-32c

'The sound of Mixbus and Mixbus32C are largely identical.'


That's completely out of the point about the sound, and you did not quote the full text that follows which is:

"In both products, the channelstrip EQ is "always in circuit" ... meaning the signal is always passing through the math, ( bypass simply means that the gain for the EQs is set to "0" ). In practice, if the EQs are both set flat or bypassed, the difference should be vanishingly small: similar to the magnitude of dither. But some people ascribe a huge difference to dither; so yes, the sound of the mixers will be fundamentally different to a discriminating user."


But moreover, from that web page:

"The Mixbus32C EQ is a recreation of our analog 32-Series EQ, which has 4 bands ( the top bands can be switched from shelving to peaking ), and both high- and low- pass filters. The 32C EQ requires a larger monitor, to fit all the controls on-screen. But feature-wise and sound-wise, it meets nearly any need for equalization; you would rarely if ever need to add an additional EQ."

From the presentation at 1:27:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YVQ__9pFg4

So they've taken the trouble to emulate a full 32C EQ circuit down to the resistors and capacitors and it results in a largely identical sound ?

UPDATE: I'm asking Harrison about that text...

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sysrqer
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby sysrqer » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:24 pm

jonetsu wrote:
"In both products, the channelstrip EQ is "always in circuit" ... meaning the signal is always passing through the math, ( bypass simply means that the gain for the EQs is set to "0" ). In practice, if the EQs are both set flat or bypassed, the difference should be vanishingly small: similar to the magnitude of dither. But some people ascribe a huge difference to dither; so yes, the sound of the mixers will be fundamentally different to a discriminating user."


But moreover, from that web page:

"The Mixbus32C EQ is a recreation of our analog 32-Series EQ, which has 4 bands ( the top bands can be switched from shelving to peaking ), and both high- and low- pass filters. The 32C EQ requires a larger monitor, to fit all the controls on-screen. But feature-wise and sound-wise, it meets nearly any need for equalization; you would rarely if ever need to add an additional EQ."

From the presentation at 1:27:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YVQ__9pFg4

So they've taken the trouble to emulate a full 32C EQ circuit down to the resistors and capacitors and it results in a largely identical sound ?

I don't think that's what it hints at at all. It's saying that if you play a track in mixbus and ardour at exactly the same time with one of them 180 degrees out of phase and no fx or added saturation then the resulting sound will not be silence (so there is a difference in sound) but it is so small that it is virtually not there. The colouring comes from the eqs, comps, and saturation (is that what it's called on the busses? I can't remember).

It's almost a nod to the age old argument of whether daws sound different and their answer is that it is different but only noticeably so to most people when you start mixing,

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bhilmers
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby bhilmers » Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:06 pm

rhydermike wrote:As others have mentioned, the workflow can be a bit awkward when working with MIDI, but the bigger problem, for me, is the MIDI bugs. For example, there seems to be a big problem with stuck notes at the end of a region.

Oh, I remember what I forgot to ask for: a MIDI "panic button". It was something I always relied on back in my Cakewak days. My current DAW doesn't have one and it sucks because I have to kill the program to stop stuck notes.

Death
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby Death » Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:12 pm

*** Just to let everyone know, I added Muse to the poll and it seems to have reset everyone's votes. Sorry about that! I didn't realise that would happen. Please vote again! ***

rncbc wrote:let there be noted that on the first account (PDC) is rather not a priority here; on the second one (always-on-top-level-windows) you should remember that it was (replied to you here in this forum) to be considered an option if given enough up votes (read tickets, issues,w/e).

after all, at the end of the day, this is about free, open-source, community driven software, no matter if it's just one dev (me) or a whole dang crowd: most of what qtractor is today, is and ever was provided by its users or fanboys (as some dare to say:) whomever input form, of which code is the most welcome of course, not a single dime has been involved whatsoever.

cheers


Yeh. I've said before that I appreciate all the work that has been done and that while I can't contribute code, I would contribute money if it's a program I ended up sticking with, just like I would pay for any other program. I know your stance on some things from what you said before, but as it stands, the things I've mentioned are what prevent me from using Qtractor right now. It's not meant to be an insult or a lack of appreciation so I hope you understand that.

Linuxmusician01 wrote:The windows that one can detach for the main Qtractor Window cannot be "put on top". However, one can put those windows inside the main window so you can see them all the time. Qtractor windows that cannot be incorporated inside the main window can be put on top via the right mouse button (like said: this is an option in almost any windows manager).

Automatic Plugin Delay Compensation (PDC) might be a nice feature to be added. I do not have a lot of experience w/ DAW's and Midi sequencers so: is this a big issue w/ DAW's? Are there a lot of plugins that have a considerable amount of delay? Can you name one?


When you do it via the right click option, it resets as soon as you've closed that window. I need it to be a permanent change.

Yes it's a big issue. It can cause out of phase issues. Look into it..

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Michael Willis
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby Michael Willis » Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:42 pm

bhilmers wrote:a MIDI "panic button"

Ardour has that, it's a button near the top left corner with an exclamation mark.

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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby jonetsu » Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:47 pm

Death wrote:*** Just to let everyone know, I added Muse to the poll and it seems to have reset everyone's votes. Sorry about that! I didn't realise that would happen. Please vote again! ***


Well then, why put Ardour and Mixbus together ? Many differences between them. One is Open Source the other one comes from a company with a strong history of making hardware consoles and is a paid product. And there are other differences.

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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby jonetsu » Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:51 pm

jonetsu wrote: So they've taken the trouble to emulate a full 32C EQ circuit down to the resistors and capacitors and it results in a largely identical sound ?

sysrqer wrote: I don't think that's what it hints at at all. It's saying that if you play a track in mixbus and ardour at exactly the same time ...


The word 'ardour' (or "Ardour") is nowhere to be found in that text.

Death
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby Death » Wed Feb 20, 2019 10:15 pm

jonetsu wrote:
Death wrote:*** Just to let everyone know, I added Muse to the poll and it seems to have reset everyone's votes. Sorry about that! I didn't realise that would happen. Please vote again! ***


Well then, why put Ardour and Mixbus together ? Many differences between them. One is Open Source the other one comes from a company with a strong history of making hardware consoles and is a paid product. And there are other differences.


Maximum of 10 choices for polls. All used up.

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sysrqer
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby sysrqer » Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:09 pm

jonetsu wrote:
jonetsu wrote: So they've taken the trouble to emulate a full 32C EQ circuit down to the resistors and capacitors and it results in a largely identical sound ?

sysrqer wrote: I don't think that's what it hints at at all. It's saying that if you play a track in mixbus and ardour at exactly the same time ...


The word 'ardour' (or "Ardour") is nowhere to be found in that text.

Why should it? It applies to any daw that doesn't claim to colour the sound by default. It's quite a controversial subject, or used to be in some circles.

Death
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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby Death » Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:45 am

sysrqer wrote:Why should it? It applies to any daw that doesn't claim to colour the sound by default. It's quite a controversial subject, or used to be in some circles.


I think what you're referring to is called 'The null test'. The idea is that if two files are supposedly identical, you should be able to play them both at the same time with the polarity inverted on one of them and you should hear absolutely nothing at all (this is called 'Phase cancellation'). If any sound is heard, they are not identical and what you're hearing is the differences between the two files. So yes, as you say, this should really work with any DAW that is not designed to colour the sound. In the case of Mixbus and 32c, in theory, most of the sound should be cancelled out when doing this test.

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Re: Your favourite Linux DAW's in 2019?

Postby bhilmers » Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:29 am

Michael Willis wrote:
bhilmers wrote:a MIDI "panic button"
Ardour has that, it's a button near the top left corner with an exclamation mark.

Well, would you look at that! Thanks MW!


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