Scheherazade

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Rainmak3r
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Scheherazade

Post by Rainmak3r »

Hi all,

since we're on lockdown in Italy, it did help to have a fun hobby to keep my mind out of things, so I eventually managed to complete one of the tracks I had put on hold for quite some time. This was also an attempt to do another collaboration with my sister, who's locked down somewhere else and so had to send me her vocals via WhatsApp :) Hopefully they'll sound alright anyway!

Coming to the track, I had actually got to a good point 3-4 months ago, and then I stopped for a few different reasons: mainly Witcher 3 (installing it proved to be a big mistake, two months of my life basically disappeared! :mrgreen: ) and the fact that I then started investing much more time on classical music instead.

That said, these past two weekends I've come back to it, and it's now ready, and I called it "Scheherazade":

https://soundcloud.com/lminiero/scheherazade

You should all be pretty familiar with the story of Scheherazade already, but to summarize, it's the premise to the whole "Arabian Nights" collection. A king/sultan is betrayed by the woman he loves, and so decides that he'll spend each night with a different woman and then have her killed. Eventually Scheherazade decides to take the matter into her own hands, and offers herself to be the next victim. When she meets the king, she starts telling him a fascinating story, thus hooking him; the morning comes, but the story isn't over, so the king spares her, waiting for het to continue the story. She finishes that one, but starts another, and the same happens night after night, until (1001 or so tales later), the king finally comes to reason and decides to marry Scheherazade.

My track tries to tell the tale of the last night: after all this time, Scheherazade is still scared she might not see the light of day, and prepares what might be her last tale, in what is a more atmospheric intro, with my sister giving Scheherazade her beautiful voice. Then the music changes with a bang, and it becomes a depiction of the tale itself: adventorous, captivating, emotional, magic carpets flying all around! Then the morning comes, and the music becomes tense, since we don't know what will happen next, up to the gran finale, when we finally get to a happy ending.

That's it in a nutshell, and I hope the track manages to capture the spirit of the narration I wanted to follow. I certainly did have a lot of fun writing this middle eastern themes, trying to merge them with what I'm more familiar with. I particularly love middle eastern themes in rock music (Kashmir by Led Zeppelin, Gates of Babylon by Rainbow and Sails of Charon by Scorpions might be the obvious references, here), and a good deal of inspiration came from tracks like the Desert Dance/Nights of Arabia combo by Kamelot or Babylon by Stratovarius (and, more recently, music by the amazing Isreaeli band Orphaned Land!), so as usual you'll hear the heavy stuff I can't seem to be able to keep out of anything.

On the technical part, there's actually more tracks in this than I put in any of my other efforts, I believe (which may have resulted in something that is a bit more of a mess, but whatever...). There's a lot of different percussions, for instance, and stuff like strings have more layers. In general, I ended up using many more free Windows VSTs as well, for the simple reason that, at the time for some instruments I couldn't find better alternatives: I've only recently found out about this soundfont, which sounds quite amazing, so I'll probably use that as well in the future.

Since a good portion had already been done months ago, this was still written with Lilypond: I actually started using MuseScore more recently, so this might change in the future, even though I still like Lilypond a lot, especially for quickly write ideas down.

For the parts I played myself, I used pretty much the same equipment as last time, that is an Akai LPK25 MIDI keyboard, my beloved Arctic White Mexican Fender HSS Stratocaster, my trusty EVH Wolfgang Standard, and a cheap Hofner bass. For guitars, I used the EVH for almost everything, except the pseudo-acoustic interlude in the middle: for that I actually wanted an acoustic guitar, but I didn't have access to the one I used previously (the one I used in Mary, which belongs to my sister), and the Yamaha I own doesn't have an integrated pickup. Some weeks ago I bought an external one, but the quality is truly awful, so I had to fall back to the clean sounds of the Strato instead: unfortunately it doesn't sound nearly as I wanted (more on that below), but it's better than nothing, and I can always re-record that part later on.

To go in more detail, and in order of "appearance" mostly:
  • Both the nay and oud at the beginning both come from an amazing free Windows VST called EasternONE: it has a ton of middle eastern instruments, with different ways of playing them, and I think it really sounds great too! It comes with microtonal capabilities on some specific notes, which I decided not to use though. I actually wanted the nay to be a duduk, initially, but the only one I could find had a very short sustain, so it really didn't work for the part.
  • The pad was done with ZynAddSubFx, and I love the ancient/mystic feel it gives. I can't remember which preset I ended up using exactly (I tested many of them), but I can try finding it again if anyone's interested.
  • The clean and chorused guitars in the intro were processed with Rakarrack (as you may know, my go-to application for all clean guitars, by now). This time I also used Rakarrack to "emulate" an acoustic guitar later in the track: I used two tracks, one with the "12 Strings" preset and another with the "Acoustic Bright" preset, and played with with the Fender. As I was saying, it doesn't sound like what I'd like there at all, but hopefully it's not completely awful either...
  • Strings are mostly done using Virtual Playing Orchestra (with different, and panned, tracks for violins, violas, celli and basses), but there's another layer using a soundfont called "kbh-strings.sf2" as well: I remember someone saying how good they thought it sounded, and I wanted to give them a try! I used this additional track to be somewhere between 2nd violins and violas, and I think the overall effect is not that bad.
  • The sparse horns and brass are VPO too, nothing fancy.
  • As anticipated, there's a ton of percussions in the middle part, and they're done using different pieces. Timpanis, cymbalis, chimes, triangles and tambourines I played myself using VPO (I was surprised to see how many percussion options it actually had!), while the middle eastern percussions I played using a Windows VST called Daf, and I think the overall effect is quite cool. I tried to give room to all of them using some panning.
  • The dulcimer was rendered using yet another free Windows VST, by Spitfire Labs. I think it sounds really good, and it has several options as you can hear from the trailer on the website. Unfortunately, for some reason, the Spitfire Labs VST decided to stop working with Wine recently... good thing I had already converted them at the time! But I hope this will get fixed, sooner or later, as they have a lot of very interesting effects, that I used other times in the past.
  • Heavy guitars, as usual, were processed with guitarix, using the "rogue" preset. The lead guitars towards the end use the "Nevermore lead" preset instead.
  • Drums too were done the usual way, using DrumGizmo and the Muldjord kit to render the patterns sketched with Hydrogen.
  • Choirs were done the same way I did in Mary, that is two separate tracks for the four voices rendered by VPO (which actually uses the excellent Sonatina choir samples).
  • In the gran finale, the loud last chord is also played by a kaman, another traditional instrument that was rendered using, you guessed it, a free VST (I probably exaggerated a bit, this time!).
  • I used the excellent Dragonfly Reverb by Michael Willis once more, using two different reverbs that I then allocated separate tracks on.
  • Audio effects like the atmospheric wind in the background at the beginning and the wedding party at the end are samples I found on FreeSound.org, and I liked right away. The "wedding party" music is apparently an actual recording of a traditional lebanese wedding, and I think it really captures the happyness of the moment.
If you got this far, thanks again for the patience, and I hope you did find this interesting or useful. I'm of course looking forward to your precious feedback as usual, and please, you guys STAY SAFE wherever you are!
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by milo »

Another ambitious work, well-executed. I almost wish I was in quarantine so that I could spend some dedicated time on music. (Not really.)

You do a good job of telling the story in music. This is a special talent of yours. The composition is very effective, and your sister really does have a lovely voice.

I don't have an electric-acoustic guitar. I always use microphones when I record acoustic guitars. Maybe you don't have microphones? If I bought a guitar with a piezoelectric bridge I would probably also put a mic on it while recording. There's nothing quite like the sound of a hollow guitar resonating.
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by Michael Willis »

Whoa, great work on this! Your orchestral + prog rock style is definitely coming together! I find your sister's accent charming, singing those English lyrics. I had no idea that the conclusion was a prerecorded wedding celebration, I totally thought that you arranged it yourself. Oh, and yes, of course I want to know what Zynaddsubfx preset you used for the pad.

Edit: You used some kind of Phrygian mode, and now I'm off listening to the soundtrack from Lawrence of Arabia. I hope you're happy.
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by lykwydchykyn »

Very exciting composition, it has a great buildup and nice finale. Your sister did a great job, and I like the way you ended it with the singing crowd.

I had a middle-eastern phase years ago; my brother spent some time in Turkey and i visited for a few weeks, bought a darbuka and a saz that I never learned to play (or tune) very well. I will say I'm not a big fan of the soundfont/ROMpler sound (especially for winds and strings), but probably because I burnt myself out on it some years back. You did a great job with the strings, though; doing the parts with layers of samples like you did (rather than one big "orchestra" patch) makes a huge difference. I really like that bit that comes in around 6:09.
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by Rainmak3r »

milo wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:59 pm Another ambitious work, well-executed. I almost wish I was in quarantine so that I could spend some dedicated time on music. (Not really.)
Thanks for listening!

Well, I was a bit of a shutter already so it's not like my lifestyle changed THAT much actually :mrgreen:
But it did give me some additional motivation to spend my weekends (since I'm still working from home during the week) to try and something more productive than binge watching yet another series (or, god forbid, install another game that could keep me hooked for months!)
milo wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:59 pm You do a good job of telling the story in music. This is a special talent of yours. The composition is very effective, and your sister really does have a lovely voice.
Thanks, I truly appreciate this, and I'll relay to her too! My mother wrote me what I thought was the nicest compliment yesterday: "when I hear your music, I feel like I'm watching a movie". She didn't specify whether it was a good or BAD movie, but I accepted it nevertheless :lol: But yes, I do like trying to tell a story, and I'm particularly fascinated by the concept of leitmotives, that I'd like to push further in the future.
milo wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:59 pm I don't have an electric-acoustic guitar. I always use microphones when I record acoustic guitars. Maybe you don't have microphones? If I bought a guitar with a piezoelectric bridge I would probably also put a mic on it while recording. There's nothing quite like the sound of a hollow guitar resonating.
A piezoelectric bridge pickup is indeed what I bought some time ago, and what I tried to use, but I'm afraid I chose one on the incredibly cheap side, and it sounded awful... even though those bridges are known to only capture the vibration of the strings, and ignore the body entirely, which I agree, is what makes acoustic and classic guitars truly special. I did buy one of those you actually stick to the guitar body too (the same one I used for the Ukulele for a piece I published some months ago) but I haven't tried that yet since I'm missing the cable to use that (it needs a 3.5mm and I only have big ones).

I didn't think about just using a microphone, though, and that's actually a very good tip! I still have that condenser mic I used for the vocals of Mary here at home, so I could try to use that with the acoustic next time.
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by Rainmak3r »

Michael Willis wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2020 11:23 pm Whoa, great work on this! Your orchestral + prog rock style is definitely coming together! I find your sister's accent charming, singing those English lyrics. I had no idea that the conclusion was a prerecorded wedding celebration, I totally thought that you arranged it yourself. Oh, and yes, of course I want to know what Zynaddsubfx preset you used for the pad.
Thanks, and knowing your expertise with orchestral stuff this really means a lot to me! I'll make sure to let my sister know about the compliments too. :D

The conclusion is a portion of this recording I found on FreeSound, which is really fun to listen to: https://freesound.org/people/Ramston/sounds/389782/

On the preset, I'll get back to you as I do remember testing dozens of them before I could find the right one :mrgreen:
Michael Willis wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2020 11:23 pm Edit: You used some kind of Phrygian mode, and now I'm off listening to the soundtrack from Lawrence of Arabia. I hope you're happy.
Hahaha, I indeed am! That soundtrack is one of the greatest I ever listened to, an amazing work by Jarre: I'm a bit ashamed to say I haven't watched the movie yet, which makes the music even so more powerful though (it manages to evoke the right images nevertheless). The soundtrack for a Prince of Persia game from 2008 has the same kind of vibe, which they were probably trying to emulate, and I think they got it exactly right, as did a personal favourite of mine, the soundtrack for Outcast by the incredibly talended Lennie Moore. But I do love soundtracks in those modes a lot, whatever setting they're in: the whole soundtrack for Antony and Cleopatra by John Scott is magnificent, for instance, as is Arnold's Stargate, even though both are more on the Egyptian side.

Speaking of Lawrence of Arabia, though, an excellent prog rock homage to the story was made by Camel, in a track called "Lawrence" from their Rajaz album: if you've never heard of it, I definitely recommend it!
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Re: Scheherazade

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lykwydchykyn wrote: Tue Mar 24, 2020 2:47 am Very exciting composition, it has a great buildup and nice finale. Your sister did a great job, and I like the way you ended it with the singing crowd.
Thanks for your kind words, on behalf of both of us! She'll be glad to hear all these praises on her voice :D
lykwydchykyn wrote: Tue Mar 24, 2020 2:47 am I had a middle-eastern phase years ago; my brother spent some time in Turkey and i visited for a few weeks, bought a darbuka and a saz that I never learned to play (or tune) very well. I will say I'm not a big fan of the soundfont/ROMpler sound (especially for winds and strings), but probably because I burnt myself out on it some years back. You did a great job with the strings, though; doing the parts with layers of samples like you did (rather than one big "orchestra" patch) makes a huge difference. I really like that bit that comes in around 6:09.
I've been on a middle-eastern phase for way too long time I'm afraid :mrgreen: I actually started collecting themes for a long piece on Cleopatra for more than 20 years, and I should really start working on that too sooner or later! But in general I've always loved those sounds, and all those orchestral references I wrote in response to Michael's post were just a few examples.

I love how you had access to those instruments! I'd definitely love to own a Saz or Oud, for instance, even though I'm personally incredibly fascinated by the Santoor. Who knows, maybe someday I'll manage to get my hands on one! And discover I'll never be able to learn how to play them as well :lol:

I'm glad you liked how I approached strings! The intent was indeed to try and make them sound a bit more "organic", and using different sources may result in them merging a bit differently and in a less synthetic way: at the same time, I realize how they'll never sound like the real thing. The 6:09 part is basically a reprise of the initial theme in a new key, and in a more "glorious" approach: initially I had much more instruments backing the melody, but I felt they were weighing everything down, so I decided to just keep the choirs, and then have everything "explode" only on the last chord for some additional buildup. I also didn't add the guitars doubling the brass until later in the production, but I feel they did give a nice touch!
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by milo »

Rainmak3r wrote: Tue Mar 24, 2020 9:15 amWell, I was a bit of a shutter already so it's not like my lifestyle changed THAT much actually :mrgreen:
But it did give me some additional motivation to spend my weekends (since I'm still working from home during the week) to try and something more productive than binge watching yet another series (or, god forbid, install another game that could keep me hooked for months!)
https://babylonbee.com/news/nations-ner ... -forbidden
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Re: Scheherazade

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milo wrote: Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:44 am
Rainmak3r wrote: Tue Mar 24, 2020 9:15 amWell, I was a bit of a shutter already so it's not like my lifestyle changed THAT much actually :mrgreen:
But it did give me some additional motivation to spend my weekends (since I'm still working from home during the week) to try and something more productive than binge watching yet another series (or, god forbid, install another game that could keep me hooked for months!)
https://babylonbee.com/news/nations-ner ... -forbidden
Something like this :mrgreen: Even though I DO miss the ability to go out... and I definitely miss food deliveries! (it's been more than a month since my last pizza, I feel witchdrawal kicking in)
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by Michael Willis »

Side note, Rainmak3r you should listen to the album Waters of Redemption.
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Re: Scheherazade

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Michael Willis wrote: Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:39 pm Side note, Rainmak3r you should listen to the album Waters of Redemption.
That's the guy that created Sonatina, right? I've stumbled upon some tracks of his occasionally, but I didn't listen to this album yet, thanks for the pointer! The Prologue sounded quite interesting, so I do know what I'll listen to while I'm working later today.

It reminded me a bit of David and Diane Arkenstone's works: I didn't listen to a lot by them either, but I very much love the "Echoes of Egypt" and "Atlantis" albums, that I feel they have been a considerable influence on me these past years. This track for instance is amazing! https://youtu.be/bcJkXJJXa8k
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Re: Scheherazade

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Michael Willis wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2020 11:23 pm Oh, and yes, of course I want to know what Zynaddsubfx preset you used for the pad.
Fount it! It's the "Ghost Ensemble" preset, in the "Companion" group (120. in my instance).
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by jonetsu »

It's nice although I did not hear the connection with progrock. Not that I'm versed in labels and tags though. The piece seems to go by w/o any anchor, it just flows by. Which is not a detrimental quality. I was surprised it ended when I was expecting more development.

The ney at the beginning really sounds like a keyboard. With the crowd sample at the end it reminded very briefly of an alaouite open air restaurants in Syria. You know, where you as a guest is invited to wash your hands with arak at the beginning of the evening but most importantly, where the band just jams around in the afternoon. The violin, percussion and keys, in the open air, with the mountains around (alaouite historically lived mostly in mountains to protect from persecution) being quite a 'magical' feel.

Ciao.
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Re: Scheherazade

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jonetsu wrote: Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:45 pm It's nice although I did not hear the connection with progrock. Not that I'm versed in labels and tags though. The piece seems to go by w/o any anchor, it just flows by. Which is not a detrimental quality. I was surprised it ended when I was expecting more development.
Thanks for listening! I do have a "fluid" relationship with the prog rock term, so you're probably right that it doesn't fit the traditional definition. I've always tended to define "progressive" something that is not static and changes all the time, rather than just using odd tempos and things like that. For this reason, I use the term "progressive" for bands from the 70s I love, like Renaissance and Kansas, but also recent bands like Moonsorrow, who create incredible atmospheres in long songs that change continuously without necessarily becoming too technical in their execution.

As to this track, I guess the only anchor I really wanted there was the initial theme, that had to be reprised at the end: in the middle, it had to just flow with the story. I often tend to write with a classical music mindset, where themes can change, maybe come back, or maybe disappear entirely: in this case, I think we can see it as an A-B-C-A pattern, themes wise.
jonetsu wrote: Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:45 pm The ney at the beginning really sounds like a keyboard. With the crowd sample at the end it reminded very briefly of an alaouite open air restaurants in Syria. You know, where you as a guest is invited to wash your hands with arak at the beginning of the evening but most importantly, where the band just jams around in the afternoon. The violin, percussion and keys, in the open air, with the mountains around (alaouite historically lived mostly in mountains to protect from persecution) being quite a 'magical' feel.

Ciao.
Oh, I actually thought the ney was one of the better sounding instruments :shock: At least because the VST seemed to make it sound a bit more natural, rather than just samples played in sequence. What didn't you like in the way it sounds?

I do love that final crowd sound, and your description makes me wonder what it must have felt to live through such a moment! Did you ever go there? It's a pity that we definitely won't be able to enjoy the same in the foreseeable feature, considering the was that has been raging there for years... a friend of mine visited Damascus years ago and fell in love with it, and was heartbroken when most of it started to fall in ruins.
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Re: Scheherazade

Post by jonetsu »

Rainmak3r wrote: Wed Mar 25, 2020 3:04 pm Thanks for listening! I do have a "fluid" relationship with the prog rock term, so you're probably right that it doesn't fit the traditional definition. I've always tended to define "progressive" something that is not static and changes all the time, rather than just using odd tempos and things like that.
Me too. And the progrock genre has also evolved through time to encompass more style variations. But still, there's the mention of 'rock' in there :)
Rainmak3r wrote: Wed Mar 25, 2020 3:04 pmFor this reason, I use the term "progressive" for bands from the 70s I love, like Renaissance and Kansas, but also recent bands like Moonsorrow, who create incredible atmospheres in long songs that change continuously without necessarily becoming too technical in their execution.
Quella Vecchia Locanda, Locanda Delle Fate, Il Castello di Atlante and so many.
Rainmak3r wrote: Wed Mar 25, 2020 3:04 pmOh, I actually thought the ney was one of the better sounding instruments :shock: At least because the VST seemed to make it sound a bit more natural, rather than just samples played in sequence. What didn't you like in the way it sounds?
Mostly the attack phase. Once the attack has passed, the rest of the sound is OK. On a ney the attack is really thick and variable. Have you tried playing one ? Not easy at all, and the very first problem is the attack of the sound itself. which is an important characteristic.
Rainmak3r wrote: Wed Mar 25, 2020 3:04 pmI do love that final crowd sound, and your description makes me wonder what it must have felt to live through such a moment! Did you ever go there? It's a pity that we definitely won't be able to enjoy the same in the foreseeable feature, considering the was that has been raging there for years... a friend of mine visited Damascus years ago and fell in love with it, and was heartbroken when most of it started to fall in ruins.
Well yes, I spent several weeks in Syria, before all these conflicts started. It's amazing what the popular description was before leaving eg. saying to colleagues that I was going to Syria. What ? You are going to this country which is on the U.S. alert list ? And then getting there and finding mostly very nice open people. I'm saying mostly because in every country there are some not-so-nice people and that's OK. We cannot generalize about a country. In Syria at that time it was obvious that some people from the interior of the country, where many less educated people are, were not-so-nice about strangers. In fact, when I was driving back from Tadmoor (Palmyra) late in the day, it was strongly recommended to not stop at a certain town for a break and coffee. It was like that.

Different country, different ways. For instance, driving at night on country roads, one will flash up the high beams towards an oncoming vehicle and the oncoming driver would do the same. After a few times seeing that I took the habit of doing it. It's a way of greeting. :)
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