Le clair de la lune

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lilith
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Le clair de la lune

Postby lilith » Thu Aug 02, 2018 11:43 pm

I'm currently working on this one..:

https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93/claire-de-lune/s-lYR4A

Originally it was over 5 minutes and now I've shortened it to ~4:30 as it was a bit boring in between.
The first version I finished in 1-2 days. Then I started rearranging. Three hours ago I thought it's shit... but now it's in a shape where I really like it.
I thought the beginning needed some french spoken words and I indeed found something which fits and gave the title of the song. :D

Wonder if the guitar solo is in time?

For the orchestral sounds I used samples from here:
https://github.com/sgossner/VSCO-2-CE

Drums are from Robin's / Glen's AVL Drum Kit.
Last edited by lilith on Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:44 pm, edited 5 times in total.
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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j_e_f_f_g
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Re: Claire Du Lune

Postby j_e_f_f_g » Fri Aug 03, 2018 12:47 am

I thought it was going to be the Debussy piece.

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Re: Claire Du Lune

Postby lilith » Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:46 pm

j_e_f_f_g wrote:I thought it was going to be the Debussy piece.


Not exactly :?
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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Re: Claire De Lune

Postby jonetsu » Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:09 pm

It's a good piece, simple progression, lots can be done there. The piece will not break any grounds, but it's well driven. The rim shots are too upfront but then, that's not a final mix. The cymbals could be a tad brighter while not bringing them forward. And maybe the spoken words could be somewhat shorter, especially since we do not hear them well.

As an aside, you corrected the title here for this thread as "du" cannot be used with feminine words of which gender 'lune" is. But "clair" does not follow the gender, it remains"clair": "Clair de lune".

And if you really want an authentic touch, the first letter of each word in a title is not capitalized in French, only the first. And if you want to take a somewhat poetic distance from Debussy's piece, you could have "Le clair de la lune" which draws attention on some bright light emanating from the moon or on a special occasion when it was seen.

Since French offers an wide array of opportunities to make meaningful play on words, "L'éclair de lune" could be a twist which then would be "A Lightning from the Moon", which could then have something to do with the electric guitar in there, which is quite nice by the way.

Salut. 8)

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Re: Claire De Lune

Postby lilith » Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:55 pm

Thanks for the very constructive critique, Jonetsu. I really made two typos in the title :/ ... It was too late yesterday.

"Lots can be done there"

You mean adding more variation or instruments?

Thanks for pointing me to the drum sounds, here it sounded good. Have to listen again.

There's a problem with the guitar timing at 2:15. Maybe I try to compose something as the current one was just improvised.
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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Re: Claire De Lune

Postby jonetsu » Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:59 pm

Well, lots. It can adopt many forms. This si what's nice with simpler structures: it lets more attention to how it can be expressed. This said, it's pretty good as is.

For the guitar, something loose isn't breaking any laws. Sometimes it's nice to have, especially as an improv, something looser than the underlying framework. There's even 'calculated' looseness in which it happens deliberately for effect here and there. Nothing wrong with loose lines per se.

Cheers.

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Re: Claire De Lune

Postby lilith » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:43 pm

Version 2(final) :mrgreen:

https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93/le-clair-de-la-lune

I added some more ambient sounds in the beginning, tried to improve the stuff according to jonetsu's suggestions (including the title) and played a bit with parallel compression for the drums to keep the transients, but to make the rest louder.

The master bus contains another multi band compressor with compression of the mid range (up to -4 - -6 dB) mainly which helps to improve clarity. I don't know if this is the purpose, but it's what I hear. The more compression I put to the mid range the sound gets more like a bathtub sound and the mud is going away. To my ears it sounds a lot better than the previous version (https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93/claire-de-lune/s-lYR4A), but I feel it's still a bit lacking in a wide stereo field. Anyway, I learned again a lot here.
The kick sounds fine on speakers but is maybe a little bit too prominent on headphones. Hope I can trust more the 1000€ speakers than the 30€ headphones, which I prefer to much more pricey models (https://www.thomann.de/de/superlux_hd668_b.htm).

I think it's good enough to make it public (?).

edit: Really strange and I observed this several times: When I listen to this song here for longer times and then listen to a previous song (e.g. Outlaw). I find the mix of the other song really bad. Like my ears got used to a distinct frequency distribution which doesn't fit the other song. The longer I listen to the other song, the more I like it (again).
Anyone else observed this?
Last edited by lilith on Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby jonetsu » Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:06 pm

This is pretty good. I didn't find the kick too overwhelming on the headphones (Sony MDR-7506, a studio standard, not the best, but standard. Seems that studios are buying them by the box. Comes with a full parts list down to the smallest screws and wires so I guess it's eventually possible to order replacement parts :? )

The piece has overall consistency I find. From beginning to end there's an overall feeling that's not disrupted but rather sweetly modulated. The mix plays its part in establishing this.

It always can be better. But one has to stop somewhere depending on the short term goal and move on. And there's most always something to say unless the production is top notch mixed by professional mixing engineers. In this case I would say that some cymbal crashes could be more blended. Like the one at 2:36, and the following soft cymbal bell/plate hits.

All in all a very good production as it carries without comprise the feeling from start to end.


I'll put the English translation to Verlaine's short poem heard at the beginning:

Your soul is a delicate landscape
Where roam charming masks and bergamasques
Playing the lute and dancing and seeming almost
Sad under their whimsical disguises.

While singing in a minor key
Of victorious love and easy life
They don't seem to believe in their happiness
And their song mingles with the moonlight,
With the sad and beautiful moonlight,
Which makes the birds in the trees dream
And sob with ecstasy the water streams,
The great slim water streams among the marbles.

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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby lilith » Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:26 pm

Perfect thanks, much appreciated!!

I was thinking to buy the Sony 7506, Audiotechnica ATH 40x or 50x (read that the 40x are flater) or the Beyerdynamic DT 770. Also the DT 250 seem to be quite good.

What's you experience with the cable? Is it stable and longlasting? And are the ear pads comfortable?

I didn't know the poem till last week and I really like it. Especially this german version

Mondlicht
Von eigner Art ist deine Seele, wie
ein Gefild' , in dem Maskierte schreiten,
die, tanzend und zur Lautenmelodie,
gleichsam ihr Leid mit Masken kleiden.

In Moll erklingen ihre Lieder
von Amors Sieg und Glücklichsein.
Doch ihre Mienen spiegeln Glück nicht wider
und ihr Gesang geht in das Mondlicht ein,

ins stille Mondlicht, schön und voll der Trauer,
das Vögel träumen lässt, hoch in den Bäumen,
und die Fontänen schluchzen lässt vor Schauer,
Fontänen, schlank und hoch, in Marmorräumen.

------
Übertragung aus dem Französischen
Verlaines 'Clair de lune' aus den 'Fêtes galantes'
Nr. 1 von Bertram Kottmann
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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Re: Claire De Lune

Postby lilith » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:42 pm

edit
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby lilith » Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:17 pm

Before I start remixing, I just want to ask here. TrojakEW found the mid range (much?) too harsh in that song. Thanks again for pointing me to this.
I think I know what he means, but I just want to make sure that other people have the same impression.


https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93/le-clair-de-la-lune
https://soundcloud.com/lilith_93
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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby TrojakEW » Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:14 pm

Yes I want to hear too if it is only me or it is really harsh. I think that frequencies somewhere about 2k are too dominant. Freq above 6k hz are slightly suppressed and looks like you removed everything above 16k hz. That air you have removed cause this mid freq to sound harsh - resonant.

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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby Loki Harfagr » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:48 am

I confirm I have the same impression, which I feel as becoming heavier and heavier on my ears after some 50 seconds of quiet audition and starts to be on the verge of painfulness at about 1:30 and over. (and I actually couldn't hear more than 3 mn on my best attempt which is a shame since I like your piece).

The auditions were made, once on your first post, once on V2 ;-), each time with a Beyerdynamics 990pro and twice today, once with same headphones, and once with a Beyerdynamics 770pro. The levels were the ones I use for mixing or reviewing, that is of course a bit lower (~ -10dB) than for mainstream listening hence the stress was not induced by pressure abuse.

I suppose it's "spottable" with a spectral analysis but I reckon I didn't make any, that's the privilege of the creator! :)

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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby jonetsu » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:15 pm

Loki Harfagr wrote: The auditions were made, once on your first post, once on V2 ;-), each time with a Beyerdynamics 990pro and twice today, once with same headphones, and once with a Beyerdynamics 770pro. The levels were the ones I use for mixing or reviewing, that is of course a bit lower (~ -10dB) than for mainstream listening hence the stress was not induced by pressure abuse.


I'd be curious to read what your impressions could be about this piece in that thread, if you'd like to:

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=18557

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Re: Le clair de la lune

Postby Loki Harfagr » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:58 am

@jonetsu

done! (in the original thread of course)


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