Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

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empowerg
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby empowerg » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:31 am

w_line wrote:Analogue Drums has an area for user-submitted mappings for unofficially supported software - was thinking of at least sending mine in to them when complete. Wonder if some of the sites that make sample packs would be willing to donate sample packs to the DG project in exchange for outsourcing building the kit mappings?


Well, that was more or less exactly what I did for DrumDrops. I got 3 kits from them and created patches for them, that's why I wrote the software. One of the kits is 11GB in samples, so doing that manually was just too much. Just be aware that (at least DrumDrops) sell them to make a living, so they won't give

Anyway, after I sent them the 3 patches, I haven't heard of them anymore. I even don't know if they included the patches in the official delivery of the libraries as they said. One of their issues were, that DrumGizmo was not available on Mac, which is what they use, so they couldn't test them.

DGPatchMaker is a bit complicated for non-DrumDrops libraries (they have exact file-naming, velocity and microphone conventions), but anyway much quicker than doing it by hand.

As I said in another post, there was not so much interest in DGPatchMaker back then, but if there is interest now, I can have a look and revive it.

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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby finotti » Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:03 pm

empowerg wrote:
w_line wrote:Analogue Drums has an area for user-submitted mappings for unofficially supported software - was thinking of at least sending mine in to them when complete. Wonder if some of the sites that make sample packs would be willing to donate sample packs to the DG project in exchange for outsourcing building the kit mappings?


Well, that was more or less exactly what I did for DrumDrops. I got 3 kits from them and created patches for them, that's why I wrote the software. One of the kits is 11GB in samples, so doing that manually was just too much. Just be aware that (at least DrumDrops) sell them to make a living, so they won't give

Anyway, after I sent them the 3 patches, I haven't heard of them anymore. I even don't know if they included the patches in the official delivery of the libraries as they said. One of their issues were, that DrumGizmo was not available on Mac, which is what they use, so they couldn't test them.

DGPatchMaker is a bit complicated for non-DrumDrops libraries (they have exact file-naming, velocity and microphone conventions), but anyway much quicker than doing it by hand.

As I said in another post, there was not so much interest in DGPatchMaker back then, but if there is interest now, I can have a look and revive it.


I've been thinking about getting some commercial drum samples to try for a while, but would like to stick with DG. Would using DGPatchMaker and a kit from DrumDrops make the conversion (mostly) straightforward? (I definitely don't want to spend the money if I can't use it, of course...)

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JamesPeters
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby JamesPeters » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:03 pm

empowerg wrote:It was still very rough on the edges and worked automatically only for the drum libraries from DrumDrops, ...

If there is a general interest, I can have a look about dusting it off a bit, finish the work on the new file formats and make the github repo public. So if some people say, they would be interested, I might give myself a push to look at it again.


Thanks for the info!

Making the XML files isn't particularly difficult but it can be time consuming if the drum banks are large. There's DGedit but its usefulness seems limited (I'm a bit confused about how it works, but it seems mostly useful if you're feeding it raw/unedited recordings/samples). Anything that makes the process simpler would be welcome, I'm sure. My kits are nearly done so I won't need it for creating them, but it might be handy for editing them and/or making different kit variants. I wouldn't want to request any of your time/effort to be spent on my account though.

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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby empowerg » Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:10 pm

finotti wrote:I've been thinking about getting some commercial drum samples to try for a while, but would like to stick with DG. Would using DGPatchMaker and a kit from DrumDrops make the conversion (mostly) straightforward? (I definitely don't want to spend the money if I can't use it, of course...)


Depends on the kit. There were always exceptions in their naming conventions, which I needed to consider for the automatic conversion.

Anyway, I have created patches for 3 kits, so if you want to get one of them, I can just send you the patches. For the other ones it depends on the kit istself, but DGPatchMaker could be used also manually, it just takes a bit of practice to use it efficiently. But I would still need to update DGPatchMaker to the new file format of DrumGizmo.

The 3 kits I created patches for are:
- Mapex Heavy Rock Kit AS Pack
- Vintage Folk Kit AS Pack
- Modern Folk Kit As Pack

The two free ones (as linked on the libremusicproducition site) are for the SMegaReaper kit and the Salamander kit which were also done with DGPatchMaker.

TBH, I currently use most of the time the Crocell Kit from the DrumGizmo site, currently there is all I need and it has a quite good quality.

lg,
Michael

empowerg
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby empowerg » Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:17 pm

JamesPeters wrote:Making the XML files isn't particularly difficult but it can be time consuming if the drum banks are large. There's DGedit but its usefulness seems limited (I'm a bit confused about how it works, but it seems mostly useful if you're feeding it raw/unedited recordings/samples). Anything that makes the process simpler would be welcome, I'm sure. My kits are nearly done so I won't need it for creating them, but it might be handy for editing them and/or making different kit variants. I wouldn't want to request any of your time/effort to be spent on my account though.


Yes, that was the case with the Vintage Folk Kit (I think) which was 11GB on samples. Much too big and error prone to create the XML files by hand (I tried).

Yeah, DGEdit is just useful when you have sampled a drumkit yourself and have the tracks raw and uncut available. Then it is really useful. I have used it for generating some patches from drum tracks from Creative Live courses where we got also the complete tracks and they specially recorded the shells for sample purposes in different velocities (in my case I have some samples but not the full kit from Periphery with Matt Halpern on the drums as a DG patch).

lg,
Michael

finotti
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby finotti » Fri Jan 25, 2019 6:57 pm

empowerg wrote:
finotti wrote:I've been thinking about getting some commercial drum samples to try for a while, but would like to stick with DG. Would using DGPatchMaker and a kit from DrumDrops make the conversion (mostly) straightforward? (I definitely don't want to spend the money if I can't use it, of course...)


Depends on the kit. There were always exceptions in their naming conventions, which I needed to consider for the automatic conversion.

Anyway, I have created patches for 3 kits, so if you want to get one of them, I can just send you the patches. For the other ones it depends on the kit istself, but DGPatchMaker could be used also manually, it just takes a bit of practice to use it efficiently. But I would still need to update DGPatchMaker to the new file format of DrumGizmo.

The 3 kits I created patches for are:
- Mapex Heavy Rock Kit AS Pack
- Vintage Folk Kit AS Pack
- Modern Folk Kit As Pack

The two free ones (as linked on the libremusicproducition site) are for the SMegaReaper kit and the Salamander kit which were also done with DGPatchMaker.

TBH, I currently use most of the time the Crocell Kit from the DrumGizmo site, currently there is all I need and it has a quite good quality.

lg,
Michael


I was looking at the Mapex one. I will probably buy it next month, if all goes as planned. I'd be great if you could send me the patch for it!

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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby empowerg » Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:20 pm

finotti wrote:I was looking at the Mapex one. I will probably buy it next month, if all goes as planned. I'd be great if you could send me the patch for it!


No Problem.
There are actually several options for the Mapex Kit: Drum Replacement Pack, Kontakt Sample Pack, Multi Velocity Pack and Single Hits Pack and the All Samples pack (which I have, which contains all of them). I created patches for the Kontakt Pack, the Multi Velocity Pack and the Single Hits Pack. The Kontakt Pack has the most samples IIRC (multiple velocities and round robin), followed by the Multi Velocity Pack (only multiple velocities) and the Single Hits Pack has only a single velocity layer.

This is the Kontakt Pack in action: https://soundcloud.com/michael-oswald-5/eli-rises-send-you-away-mixing-exercise. OK, not the best mix, learned a lot in the mean time...

Just drop me a message when you need the patches (and which ones).

lg,
Michael

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w_line
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby w_line » Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:39 am

I just realized that it was Michael's blogpost that I was using as reference for building DG kits from sample packs - So thanks for that! :D

No pressure to tune-up/release the DGPatchMaker from my perspective. I think a generic tool for building kits from samples would be super cool - but have also had my own stints developing/maintaining open source programs - know it is something that can be a drag if you feel more like you are getting talked into it by users rather than something you are doing cause you are really excited about it yourself.

Building kits by hand ended up being somewhat quicker than I expected. Incorporating some careful Search/Replace operations sped things up quite a bit (assuming the samples have sane naming conventions).

Do we have a guess about when we might see the next DG release (hopefully including the Round-Robin fix :wink: ) ? Definitely don't mean to sound impatient or anything - just excited.

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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby deva » Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:00 pm

Sorry to interrupt this exciting forum-thread.

I recently refactored the XML parser code of drumgizmo and actually decided to remove the support for the old instrument version with the velocity groups because all of our kits no longer uses it and it was a pain to maintain both of them.
However, due to this thread, I saw some pretty fine arguments for keeping it, at least until we got a better alternative, so I used a couple of weeks to re-implement the old format in the new parser framework.

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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby empowerg » Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:56 pm

deva wrote:Sorry to interrupt this exciting forum-thread.

I recently refactored the XML parser code of drumgizmo and actually decided to remove the support for the old instrument version with the velocity groups because all of our kits no longer uses it and it was a pain to maintain both of them.
However, due to this thread, I saw some pretty fine arguments for keeping it, at least until we got a better alternative, so I used a couple of weeks to re-implement the old format in the new parser framework.


Cool. Is there a description of the actual file format (and the next intended one)? Just if I want to update DGPatchMaker with it...

lg,
Michael

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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby chaot4 » Sun Jul 21, 2019 1:57 pm

Just a quick general update for people reading this thread now: DrumGizmo is now capable to emulate round robin as a special case. So, it is possible to convert drumkits with RR samples to DrumGizmo. You can read more in the release notes of 0.9.17:

https://drumgizmo.org/wiki/doku.php?id= ... zmo-0.9.17

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w_line
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby w_line » Sun Jul 21, 2019 7:54 pm

Yeah! I started rebuilding the kit earlier this week when I saw the announcement. Finally got it all put together this weekend and the new sample selection algorithm and gui options seem to be handling the round robin setup nicely! Huge thanks to the developers for all their work!

Once I have things cleaned up a bit more I can share the mappings to the "Boxer" kit in case anybody else want to take it for a spin. It does have the issue of the samples being normalized. I may start up a new thread on that topic...

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funkmuscle
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby funkmuscle » Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:08 am

chaot4 wrote:Just a quick general update for people reading this thread now: DrumGizmo is now capable to emulate round robin as a special case. So, it is possible to convert drumkits with RR samples to DrumGizmo. You can read more in the release notes of 0.9.17:

https://drumgizmo.org/wiki/doku.php?id= ... zmo-0.9.17

If anyone does convert their kits that are RR to DG, y'all mind sharing?

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w_line
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Re: Using Round Robin Samples in Drum Gizmo

Postby w_line » Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:18 am

Here is a link to my mappings for "The Boxer".

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1N2f5CNtPbzSO4vxzJE09ytlU48-VnaaP

Currently only Snare2 is mapped (There are 3 snares).
The ClickyKit is currently disabled, since it is incomplete.

The DG-Mapping folder (once unzipped) just needs to be placed in the "Boxer" folder next to the "Samples" folder.


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