[Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

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Glocke
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[Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby Glocke » Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:28 am

Hey guys,

since close mics do rarely picture the entire situation, we're all using overheads and room mics on our mixes. For me, dealing with OH and room mics is not often easy, because a lot of data is process simutaneously (e.g. cymbals and hihat are going wild, while I try to get THE snare sound out of the OH+Snare close mics). Hence the following suggestion:

Each instrument (snare, kick etc.) provides separated close and room mic channels accessable in the DAW through the plugin.

Sure, this feature is "unnatural" for drum sounds but may offer a special bonus to the sampling approach.

Since the data is already there, its just an extension to the channel setup. So a solo'd snare-overhead-channel could be combined with the close mic snare top & bottom by the user, creating a flexible and imense sound without a bleeding hihat etc.

Let's discuss this - maybe it's combinable with the bleed-control-settings :)
  • Bass player & vocalist of Breaper (Death Metal, Thuringia/Germany)
  • Minor dev of DrumGizmo (LGPLv3 Drumsampling Tool)
  • Dev & game artist of Racod's Lair (Pixelart Dungeoncrawler)

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deva
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby deva » Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:45 am

I guess the most easy solution would be to simply put the snare on it's own midi track alongside a midi track with the rest of the kit and then have 2 drumgizmo plugin instances in the project.
This would not be possible in the older versions because of memory consumption, but since 0.9.14 it would be rather easy because of the disk streaming functionality.
By having the snare on it's own midi track you can simply map the 2 close mic channels to the same busses from the other midi track with the full kit but then map the OH channels from the snare midi track to it's own snare-OH bus pair.
Then you'd have more or less exactly what you were asking for (if I understood you correctly) without having to introduce any changes to the DG engine and file format.

BTW: The humanized timing feature is very close to going gold - check out the latency_filter branch: http://cgit.drumgizmo.org/drumgizmo.git ... ncy_filter

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Glocke
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby Glocke » Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:31 pm

Ah right.. diskstreaming finally allows this! :D
  • Bass player & vocalist of Breaper (Death Metal, Thuringia/Germany)
  • Minor dev of DrumGizmo (LGPLv3 Drumsampling Tool)
  • Dev & game artist of Racod's Lair (Pixelart Dungeoncrawler)

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funkmuscle
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby funkmuscle » Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:04 pm

dunno if this is the right place or topic but the lastest git, the DG plugin has the bleeding volume. How does it work? do we need new kits for it?
The DRS kit I find bleeds the most. I love the kit but to get a nice click out of the beater of the kick, I really need to turn the room tracks down low or not use.
Also the snare ans cymbals pops up a lot in the mixing of other parts of the kit.
So does the bleed volume fix that issue?

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deva
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby deva » Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:42 pm

Yes, the next version will have bleed-control. But it hasn't been released yet and none of the drumkits on the website supports it.
When we release it (hopefully in a few weeks from now) we will make sure to update all the kits with the new bleed-control information.
the new feature marks some of the instrument channels as "main". For example the snare-top and snare-bottom mics for a snare drum.
The rest of the channels are considered "bleed channels".
The bleed channel volume of all instruments are then controlled using a single slider in the UI, ie. you can turn down the volume of all bleed channels on all instruments to get a more "clinical" sounding drumkit.
Drumkits not supporting the bleed control will show the bleed-slider greyed out.
If you want to play with it, you can compile DG yourself from latest git master and then add

Code: Select all

main="true"
attributes to the

Code: Select all

channelmap
tags in the drumkit files.
Have fun :-)

finotti
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby finotti » Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:26 pm

deva wrote:Yes, the next version will have bleed-control.


That's fantastic! Many thanks to all developers!

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funkmuscle
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby funkmuscle » Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:39 pm

deva wrote:Drumkits not supporting the bleed control will show the bleed-slider greyed out.
If you want to play with it, you can compile DG yourself from latest git master and then add

Code: Select all

main="true"
attributes to the

Code: Select all

channelmap
tags in the drumkit files.

Thanx Deva for the great work from you and the DG gang.
I'm not quite following the channelmap tags you suggested.
I've compiled from git already but just not sure what you meant. :mrgreen:

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deva
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby deva » Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:57 pm

Like this:

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<drumkit name="DRSKit2" description="DRSKit2 full">
  <channels>
    <channel name="AmbL"/>
    <channel name="AmbR"/>
    <channel name="Kdrum_back"/>
    <channel name="Kdrum_front"/>
    <channel name="Hihat"/>
    <channel name="OHL"/>
    <channel name="OHR"/>
    <channel name="Ride"/>
    <channel name="Snare_bottom"/>
    <channel name="Snare_top"/>
    <channel name="Tom1"/>
    <channel name="Tom2"/>
    <channel name="Tom3"/>
  </channels>
  <instruments>
    <instrument name="Crash_left_shank" file="Crash_left_shank/Crash_left_shank.xml">
      <channelmap in="AmbL" out="AmbL" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="AmbR" out="AmbR" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="Kdrum_back" out="Kdrum_back"/>
      <channelmap in="Kdrum_front" out="Kdrum_front"/>
      <channelmap in="Hihat" out="Hihat"/>
      <channelmap in="OHL" out="OHL" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="OHR" out="OHR" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="Ride" out="Ride"/>
      <channelmap in="Snare_bottom" out="Snare_bottom"/>
      <channelmap in="Snare_top" out="Snare_top"/>
      <channelmap in="Tom1" out="Tom1"/>
      <channelmap in="Tom2" out="Tom2"/>
      <channelmap in="Tom3" out="Tom3"/>
    </instrument>
    .
    .
    .
  </instruments>
<drumkit>

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funkmuscle
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby funkmuscle » Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:09 pm

deva wrote:Like this:

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<drumkit name="DRSKit2" description="DRSKit2 full">
  <channels>
    <channel name="AmbL"/>
    <channel name="AmbR"/>
    <channel name="Kdrum_back"/>
    <channel name="Kdrum_front"/>
    <channel name="Hihat"/>
    <channel name="OHL"/>
    <channel name="OHR"/>
    <channel name="Ride"/>
    <channel name="Snare_bottom"/>
    <channel name="Snare_top"/>
    <channel name="Tom1"/>
    <channel name="Tom2"/>
    <channel name="Tom3"/>
  </channels>
  <instruments>
    <instrument name="Crash_left_shank" file="Crash_left_shank/Crash_left_shank.xml">
      <channelmap in="AmbL" out="AmbL" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="AmbR" out="AmbR" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="Kdrum_back" out="Kdrum_back"/>
      <channelmap in="Kdrum_front" out="Kdrum_front"/>
      <channelmap in="Hihat" out="Hihat"/>
      <channelmap in="OHL" out="OHL" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="OHR" out="OHR" main="true"/>
      <channelmap in="Ride" out="Ride"/>
      <channelmap in="Snare_bottom" out="Snare_bottom"/>
      <channelmap in="Snare_top" out="Snare_top"/>
      <channelmap in="Tom1" out="Tom1"/>
      <channelmap in="Tom2" out="Tom2"/>
      <channelmap in="Tom3" out="Tom3"/>
    </instrument>
    .
    .
    .
  </instruments>
<drumkit>

thanx dude.. I did opened that file but didn't scroll down.

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funkmuscle
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby funkmuscle » Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:20 pm

Deva, so if I wanted to reduce the bleeding of the snare in the kick drum, where would I put the main=true?
Should I place it on the snare section or the kick drum?

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deva
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby deva » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:43 pm

You need to put it on the snare instrument on all other channels than the kick-drum channels.

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funkmuscle
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Re: [Suggestion] Individual Close-Mic-/Room-Mic-Channels

Postby funkmuscle » Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:42 pm

deva wrote:You need to put it on the snare instrument on all other channels than the kick-drum channels.

WOW!!! it works!! All I wanted to do was remove the snare bleed in the kick and it worked amazingly! The DRS kit now for me sounds like the other DG kits with less snare bleeding into the kick yet still sounding natural as with the volume, I left a little bleed in of course from the other instruments as I only eliminated the snare..
Thanx again Deva


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