Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

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folderol
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Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by folderol »

There seem to be some misconceptions here (and many other places) so I'm going to try to clarify what's what.

First of all, lets be clear that Yoshimi is not the same as ZynAddSubFX. It started to go it's own way in 2009, and currently is only superficially similar. At the same time we have taken great care to maintain the sound and instrument patches such that you can create a patch with Zyn 2.2.1 and it will sound identical when played with Yoshimi. Similarly you can create a patch on Yoshimi and, provided you don't include the new extensions it will sound identical in Zyn. Furthermore, even if you do include the extensions, Zyn will still be able to use the patch and it will sound reasonably similar - just not recognising the new bits (I'm still able to run 2.2.1 on one machine). For more dramatic extensions we created our own saved instrument type, so there is no question of contaminating the originally specified one.

A frequent complaint is that there are too many windows cluttering up the display. Well there doesn't need to be! There is only one window that has to be visible - the main one - and that is about as compact as we can make it while still giving easy access to everything else. Also, you very rarely need to have more than two open at the some time (including the main one). Something that people just never seem to get, is that all the windows that form a stack can be traversed using the right hand mouse button instead of the left. When you do this, as the new window opens, the parent closes. Similarly if you do a right click on the window's Close button it will also reopen the parent. All windows remember both their last seen positions and their sizes. Yes since V 2.0 all windows are resizable and will remain completely in scale.

Yoshimi will always keep you informed of it's current state - not only looking at the respective windows but also via the Console window. Buttons, knobs, switches, etc. maintain a clearly defined behaviour - there should be no surprises. There are also extensive tooltips. We maintain clear and sensible pop-up dialogs for warnings and choices. In addition we use the toolbar as it was originally intended to keep you informed exactly where you are! For example:
Yoshimi: AddSynth Voice - Part 1 Echo Pad, Kit 9

Muscle memory is a thing (who knew?). Where it is impossible to add a feature without changing the interface we take care to ensure there is a little change to the existing layout as possible. The modern trend seems to be to hide as much as possible from the user, within a single window that has no clear boundaries or obvious choices. We have no intention of 'modernising'.

If that still isn't satisfactory, you don't actually need the GUI at all. Yoshimi has command line capability (complete with extensive help text) such that every command is available from a terminal window - no exceptions. This also has some scripting capability - which the GUI doesn't have!

Finally (at last?) Yoshimi is still under continuous development. I won't go into details, but there are some very signficant improvements just around the corner.
The Yoshimi guy {apparently now an 'elderly'}
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Audiojunkie
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by Audiojunkie »

I want to thank you for your GUI work. Because you support High Resolution Screens and scaling, I use Yoshimi over the original Zyn--even with Zyn's Fusion interface. Your's simply works much better! :)
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by Linuxmusician01 »

folderol wrote: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:06 pm [...]

Finally (at last?) Yoshimi is still under continuous development. I won't go into details, but there are some very signficant improvements just around the corner.
I hope the toolkit that the GUI uses will be updated. I personally am very picky in interfaces for the synth I use. If it's uninspiring (i.e. looks like it's from the nineties) I'm not inclined to use it. But I am extremely picky: I wouldn't use Ableton Live because of it's interface/widgets that look like Windows 3.11. Same thing goes for Win 10 & 11.

Keep up the good work and have fun developing Yoshimi! :)
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by Basslint »

Linuxmusician01 wrote: Tue Apr 12, 2022 9:46 am I hope the toolkit that the GUI uses will be updated. I personally am very picky in interfaces for the synth I use. If it's uninspiring (i.e. looks like it's from the nineties) I'm not inclined to use it. But I am extremely picky: I wouldn't use Ableton Live because of it's interface/widgets that look like Windows 3.11. Same thing goes for Win 10 & 11.

Keep up the good work and have fun developing Yoshimi! :)
FLTK is actually pretty active, last commit is from 3 hours ago (source)! :D

I personally like Yoshimi's interface. I think a designer could turn it into a beautiful GUI just by styling it, the default FLTK themes are a bit dated but FLTK itself is flexible enough to allow complete restyling (I've done it with rakarrack in the past as a proof-of-concept).
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by Largos »

I like how the changes on that page range from 4 days to 24 years ago :lol:
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by glowrak guy »

folderol wrote: Mon Apr 11, 2022 1:06 pm
Finally (at last?) Yoshimi is still under continuous development. I won't go into details, but there are some very signficant improvements just around the corner.
Yoshimi is one of the top ten instruments combing low-stress usage, with wonderfully creative potential.
One small change I would love to see, is a flip of the boxes for setting up multiple patches. Having the order
changed to:

Part

Enabled

Midi

would make it a wii bit easier (less arcade-like) to set up multiple layers, which I almost
always do when using Yoshimi. Alternately, having a config option for all layers to be defaulted
to channel 1, would be just as welcome. (I hope that's not something I've missed in the manual :wink: )
I'm afraid to even ask for hints about the new features!
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by folderol »

Hmmm. "State" is your friend I think :)
Set up exactly what you want (including most config settings) then save it with the State dialog.
There are two options there:
1
Just as a named state that you can reload by name (or from the 'State->Recent States' list)

2
In Yoshimi->Settings->Switches:
a: check "Start With Default State"
b: in the State dialog "Save As Default"
This will then be loaded at startup and every time you hit the reset button.

Having said that, When I want layering I set the part to 'Kit Mode' then fill in the bits I want :)
{cough}16 layers should be enough for anyone {cough} :lol:

We are very reluctant to change the layout unless it's for a new feature that can't be fitted in any other way - you should hear all the complaints from the Windows vict^H^H^H^H users every time Microsoft pulls that kind of stunt!
The Yoshimi guy {apparently now an 'elderly'}
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by tavasti »

I suppose this old set of videos made for Zyn are pretty relevant for learning Yoshimi https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... FBXV9CK8nH

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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by glowrak guy »

folderol wrote: Wed Apr 13, 2022 3:18 pm Hmmm. "State" is your friend I think :)
Thanks much for the tips! I loaded 5 sounds on midi channel one, and saved the state with a name,
and reloaded it by name on next startup.
Cheers
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Re: Understanding Yoshimi's GUI Structure

Post by folderol »

tavasti wrote: Wed Apr 13, 2022 7:20 pm I suppose this old set of videos made for Zyn are pretty relevant for learning Yoshimi https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... FBXV9CK8nH
A few of these are yes. However, these days Yoshimi comes with a 'friendly' HTML User Guide, that you can pick up from the 'Yoshimi' drop-down menu. This also provides a link to the considerably re-worked Advanced Reference Manual (pdf) - specially suited to those night owls that need to do something quietly :lol:
The Yoshimi guy {apparently now an 'elderly'}
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