Gullfoss

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funkmuscle
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Gullfoss

Post by funkmuscle »

Hey, do we have anything like this for Linux?

Code: Select all

https://www.soundtheory.com/home
video demo:

Code: Select all

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyqRALqicA4&t=28s
Ok, I know we have some engineers here and y'all will say use your ears but when you're in a bedroom that's not treated and you cannot afford studio sessions and all you wanna do is get the music out of your head so you could share or make a living or whatever.

Stuff like this and SonarWorks are great if you're a bedroom engineer who just wanna make music and don't have the money to go fully pro.

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cjoke
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by cjoke »

why would you want this? when there are tons of free plugins in linux! For what I understand , I do this with a EQ and a compressor. If I want to soften the outcome a bit I use a saturator. and the list is long. I dont even use just 1 compressor for every thing, I try several compressors, and sometimes when I load a plugin I dont even have to tweek it before it sounds good. I guess it is the same for gullfoss, works good for some instruments and not so good for other.
Cheers :)
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by tavasti »

cjoke wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 7:43 am
why would you want this? when there are tons of free plugins in linux! For what I understand , I do this with a EQ and a compressor. If I want to soften the outcome a bit I use a saturator. and the list is long. I dont even use just 1 compressor for every thing, I try several compressors, and sometimes when I load a plugin I dont even have to tweek it before it sounds good. I guess it is the same for gullfoss, works good for some instruments and not so good for other.
Some people don't want tons of plugins, but single or few that 'just works'. Sure there isn't simple solution for all needs. Not a plugin, or like you say, not a same set of plugins.

But I can clearly understand desire for such plugin. Not everybody wants to use hours or days for finding right sound (and most likely still fail in it). Using automatic 'make this sound better' thing will give more time for making music instead of mixing.
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tavasti
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by tavasti »

funkmuscle wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 8:37 pm
Hey, do we have anything like this for Linux?
Not directly same thing, but for same need:
https://github.com/sergree/matchering
https://github.com/brummer10/GxMatchEQ.lv2
Linux veteran & Novice musician

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sysrqer
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by sysrqer »

cjoke wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 7:43 am
why would you want this? when there are tons of free plugins in linux! For what I understand , I do this with a EQ and a compressor. If I want to soften the outcome a bit I use a saturator. and the list is long. I dont even use just 1 compressor for every thing, I try several compressors, and sometimes when I load a plugin I dont even have to tweek it before it sounds good. I guess it is the same for gullfoss, works good for some instruments and not so good for other.
Cheers :)
There aren't really any plugins like this on linux. There is a growing trend for this sort of thing in Windows/Mac plugins where 'intelligent' processes are carried out, such as the 'AI' features Izotope's Ozone and Sonible SmartEQ, and there an increasing technology gap between what they do and what can currently be done natively in linux. The plugin in question here is not really the same as a static EQ and compressor, the closest thing would probably be a dynamic multiband compressor with many precise bands which change frequency according to the input signal. It would be virtually impossible to emulate this with static plugins, even if you automated the bands based on the amplitude and frequency of the input signal you would be there for a very long time drawing automation which affects at audio rates (300 times per second according to this plugin's website), assuming you could even identify all the areas needing adjustment.

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Re: Gullfoss

Post by bluebell »

Are such plugins interesting? Sure.

Are they needed to make a good mix/master? No.

The market is saturated with EQs and Compressors. So manufacturers have to invent new stuff that promises a perfect sound for any bedroom producer.
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funkmuscle
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by funkmuscle »

tavasti wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 8:29 am
funkmuscle wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 8:37 pm
Hey, do we have anything like this for Linux?
Not directly same thing, but for same need:
https://github.com/sergree/matchering
https://github.com/brummer10/GxMatchEQ.lv2
Yes I use both of those but what those do is try to match up my mix something that I thought sounded similar in most aspects.
And yes I'm throwing a compressor here, EQ over there and so on but I'm on the 18th floor and the time it takes 2 mix all that when you're not hearing it properly, putting it on some device, getting in the elevator and running to the underground parking to listen in my car just to be disappointed is beyond frustrating that's why things like that would come in handy. Even for just making the trips to the car drop from 20 * maybe down to 10 is worth it. A compressor or an EQ won't help anything if you don't have the right equipment art treated room that's why things like that come in handy. To be honest, I would rather do things the old school late because I use a very little plugins. I have mixbus 32c so I use basically what it comes with. So it's not really a plug-in thing it's just a time-saving thing from my point of view.
Thanks for the input guys.
Matchering2.0 suggest on not adding anything to the master bus so that frustrated the crap out of me because I have to go and change everything I did and still not satisfied with the outcome of it so I gave up on using it.
MatchEQ I love but I think some reason which is most likely my fault, the final product is crystal clear but it seems to eliminate a lot of the bottom end. Could be pointing to my mix which again turns back to that original question.

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Re: Gullfoss

Post by JamesPeters »

That product is very interesting, however it doesn't negate the need for basic mixing skills. Learning to use equalizers and compressors effectively takes time. It took me a lot longer than some others. It would be nice if there were a perfect shortcut but there isn't. The good part of this is it doesn't take expensive software and a lot of time to make a good mix once you understand the basic tools. You can always go down a rabbit hole spending as much time as you want, but a decent sounding mix should be relatively easily to achieve reasonably quickly.

You should be able to mix even in a small relatively untreated room with monitors as long as you don't use them at a louder volume. The trick with that is to use enough sound damping material so the room doesn't resonate a lot with mid-range. (Foam tiles on the walls, or blankets etc.) Also use monitors that make sense for the application. Since you live in an apartment (and I'm guessing you don't have much room plus also you can't turn up volume loud), you might as well just get something smaller that does a good job as it is. I use Micca MB42X speakers with a small basic stereo poweramp; other than turning up the bass control on the amp a little bit, there's no trick to making these sound good for mixing.

If you don't have a room suitable for mixing with monitors at all, I recommend you try a bunch of headphones. Find a set with which you can mix reliably. I know you probably heard never to do that, but you can mix with a good set of headphones, and in some cases it's far better than the alternative. Your case might be one of those. Plus it's good to be checking your mix with headphones anyway. Between a good set of headphones and a decent set of monitors, you should have enough to make a decent mix. I can hear some things better with the headphones than with the monitors, and the monitors give me a better sense of what's happening in the stereo field.

There's no perfect set of monitors and there's no perfect set of headphones. I'm not saying that you shouldn't try to get good things, but also maybe don't obsess about it too much if you know it sounds good with music that you test it with (music you know well).

The rest is just the time you put in, and what you get out of it. With any luck it takes you a lot less time than it took me. :)

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Re: Gullfoss

Post by funkmuscle »

JamesPeters wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 4:42 pm
That product is very interesting, however it doesn't negate the need for basic mixing skills. Learning to use equalizers and compressors effectively takes time. It took me a lot longer than some others. It would be nice if there were a perfect shortcut but there isn't. The good part of this is it doesn't take expensive software and a lot of time to make a good mix once you understand the basic tools. You can always go down a rabbit hole spending as much time as you want, but a decent sounding mix should be relatively easily to achieve reasonably quickly.

You should be able to mix even in a small relatively untreated room with monitors as long as you don't use them at a louder volume. The trick with that is to use enough sound damping material so the room doesn't resonate a lot with mid-range. (Foam tiles on the walls, or blankets etc.) Also use monitors that make sense for the application. Since you live in an apartment (and I'm guessing you don't have much room plus also you can't turn up volume loud), you might as well just get something smaller that does a good job as it is. I use Micca MB42X speakers with a small basic stereo poweramp; other than turning up the bass control on the amp a little bit, there's no trick to making these sound good for mixing.

If you don't have a room suitable for mixing with monitors at all, I recommend you try a bunch of headphones. Find a set with which you can mix reliably. I know you probably heard never to do that, but you can mix with a good set of headphones, and in some cases it's far better than the alternative. Your case might be one of those. Plus it's good to be checking your mix with headphones anyway. Between a good set of headphones and a decent set of monitors, you should have enough to make a decent mix. I can hear some things better with the headphones than with the monitors, and the monitors give me a better sense of what's happening in the stereo field.

There's no perfect set of monitors and there's no perfect set of headphones. I'm not saying that you shouldn't try to get good things, but also maybe don't obsess about it too much if you know it sounds good with music that you test it with (music you know well).

The rest is just the time you put in, and what you get out of it. With any luck it takes you a lot less time than it took me. :)
Yes trust me I know all of the above and I've been doing fine with it it's just something that's time consuming. I know for a fact that the time it takes to do it here if I had the proper tools I would get work done a lot quicker. I've already settled to the fact that the way it was done in the old school is the way to do it because these guys had no plugins are all the fancy stuff but they got by. The thing they have that I don't is the properly treated room or if not the money to buy multiple headphones to get the right one or different monitors. I've been there and examine every possible thing there is to help in a bedroom situation because I'm here with my wife and daughter in a very small condo so that's why I'm reaching for that. Personally am not a fan of too many plugins because I find just like playing the guitar, a lot of guys like to put delay on the guitar which to me personally hides the mistakes so I like things raw the old school way. I'm just looking for something that would make life go a lot faster when I am mixing my band's material.
Before Sonarworks reached out to this forum, I started a thread asking about something like that for us. I got basically the same answer as I'm getting here but once they reached out, I noticed the same people jumped at it so I think yes there is a need for it. Everybody would rather spend time getting the music out then sitting there for hours maybe even weeks try to fix up one song. If that time could be cut in half I don't know anyone who would not be happy with that. That's all I'm trying to get across here is something to speed up the work because everyone wants to get from A to B but we all want to get there as fast as possible.
Don't get me wrong, everything you guys are saying I'm looking at it as positive because that's only how you learn is by asking questions so all the feedback I'm getting from you guys I am grateful for it because I'm reading a lot of things I did not think of so I am grateful and I'm saying thank you but I still think everybody would be happier with something that can speed up the mixing process.

tramp
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by tramp »

funkmuscle wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 3:03 pm
MatchEQ I love but I think some reason which is most likely my fault, the final product is crystal clear but it seems to eliminate a lot of the bottom end. Could be pointing to my mix which again turns back to that original question.
Didn't noticed that.
But, I've just build the output stage of the Pultec PEQ1A, I may add this to the MatchEQ to allow a bit warm up.
On the road again.

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funkmuscle
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by funkmuscle »

tramp wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 6:23 am
funkmuscle wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 3:03 pm
MatchEQ I love but I think some reason which is most likely my fault, the final product is crystal clear but it seems to eliminate a lot of the bottom end. Could be pointing to my mix which again turns back to that original question.
Didn't noticed that.
But, I've just build the output stage of the Pultec PEQ1A, I may add this to the MatchEQ to allow a bit warm up.
Dude, that sounds very interesting. Let me know when it's ready because I would love to give it a try.

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Re: Gullfoss

Post by tavasti »

funkmuscle wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 3:03 pm
And yes I'm throwing a compressor here, EQ over there and so on but I'm on the 18th floor and the time it takes 2 mix all that when you're not hearing it properly, putting it on some device, getting in the elevator and running to the underground parking to listen in my car just to be disappointed is beyond frustrating that's why things like that would come in handy. Even for just making the trips to the car drop from 20 * maybe down to 10 is worth it. A compressor or an EQ won't help anything if you don't have the right equipment art treated room that's why things like that come in handy.
I don't either have acoustically treated room or proper monitors. I have pair of 30€ Pioneer headphones and very badly placed pair of Behringer monitors. Still I don't think equipment is limiting my possibilities to make music, my skills are the limiting thing.
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funkmuscle
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by funkmuscle »

tavasti wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 3:34 pm
funkmuscle wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 3:03 pm
And yes I'm throwing a compressor here, EQ over there and so on but I'm on the 18th floor and the time it takes 2 mix all that when you're not hearing it properly, putting it on some device, getting in the elevator and running to the underground parking to listen in my car just to be disappointed is beyond frustrating that's why things like that would come in handy. Even for just making the trips to the car drop from 20 * maybe down to 10 is worth it. A compressor or an EQ won't help anything if you don't have the right equipment art treated room that's why things like that come in handy.
I don't either have acoustically treated room or proper monitors. I have pair of 30€ Pioneer headphones and very badly placed pair of Behringer monitors. Still I don't think equipment is limiting my possibilities to make music, my skills are the limiting thing.
It doesn't stop me from writing and mixing, the lack of good equipment and properly treated room is a time waster. It takes 10 minutes coming from the 18th floor to the car multiple times per day.
Let me ask everyone this, who would like something that can help you speed up your mixing? I'd say everyone. This will not make my mixes better if I don't know what I'm doing but heck yeah it would save me time and I'd be more productive.
I'd rather have more free time to practise my guitar skills. The positive in the way I'm working is that I get to develop my mixing skills but it's just too much of my time that I'm burnt out at the end. I mean resting my ears more meaning time being lost.
I'd just like a plugin that assist in speeding up things.
At least Airwindows has a Monitoring plugin that helps as it emulates different rooms, cans monitors etc.
Thanks again guys as I'm learning from your comments.

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JamesPeters
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Re: Gullfoss

Post by JamesPeters »

To be clear: I didn't say this plugin wouldn't help you. But there are other things you can do, and you don't need to run up and down a billion floors to do it. :mrgreen: It's possible that you're close to not needing something like this at all, with a bit more practice (or maybe some blankets on the walls, or better headphones, etc.) and those things would help you anyway. That's all I meant.

FWIW: I downloaded the command-line Matchering because I think it might help me. And I have a matching EQ in Reaper (a JS plugin which works astoundingly well); I've used it a few times already. I can do without both these things, but I like having them.

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Re: Gullfoss

Post by glowrak guy »

Harrison Mixbus daw could be useful, as your sound can be recorded or
imported into that time-tested console environment, with it's own
useful plugins and capabilities. The price is amazingly low
for the potential and tools, and is often on sale.

You can view a track in audacity, import it to mixbus,
export, and visually/sonically compare the two versions.
Then dig in to the details.

IK Multimedia sell T-racks Sunset Sound Studio,
and Lurssen Mastering Console as plugin suites
with similar purpose, that run in modern
wine/reaper, and when wrapped by LinVst,
may also run in Linux Mixbus, worth trying the demos.

You could have three world-class sound facilities
at your fingertips. Youtube has videos.

Mixbus playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... bZIZYBNht-

Sunset: https://youtu.be/sXBC-y_Dy7A

Lurssen https://youtu.be/PmQE2c1GXfA

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