[Poll] The Future of Rakarrack

[ssj71]

Nobody has stepped up to volunteer as a new maintaner of Rakarrack or to assist in merging the codebases of the standalone and the plugins. I started this task but it is very tedious and time consuming. Especially because I really have little use for the standalone jack app in my workflow, I am losing motivation for this effort and haven't been working on it much lately. I would like to say that I'll complete the merge and then can resume improving both, but when I'm not very excited for the result there's a notable chance it won't ever get finished. I have several things in mind that would mostly improve the backend for the effects but I have not been working on them because it complicates the merge.

So I'm looking for either motivation or reasonable arguments to abandon the merge. I would like to know it will be very helpful to many people to merge the 2 codebases or if the community feels its ok to decide rakarrack is stable as it is, but the future is in the plugins so let the code diverge further. I'm sure it won't be unanimous, but I'd like to hear everyone's opinions.

[asbak]

My 2c

There's obviously a market for both versions but considering the levels of time and motivation you have available to you perhaps it would make more sense to concentrate on the plugins?
If and when at some point Capt Hero arrives to rescue the application version then he/she could use the plugs codebase as a base to work from?

[tatch]

i'm fairly repulsed by the standalone gui and don't see a compelling reason to improve it when we have decent plugin hosts already.

[glowrak guy]

I like the rakarrack gui, and being able to run as many instances as desired,
makes it very fast and useful for any effects need. I also like the jalv-select, for more minimalist setups.

A choice of larger interface sizes for rakarrack would be my first choice as a priority.
But I've never thought it as lacking in overall performance, so I would say
'use your precious spare time exactly the way you want to', and not worry about us consumers.

Perhaps a tabbed jalv-select gui for loading multiple effects would also be handy.
Some people don't want/need a daw software and related dependencies
just to access a few effects.
Cheers

[tatch]

Perhaps a tabbed jalv-select gui for loading multiple effects would also be handy.
Some people don't want/need a daw software and related dependencies
just to access a few effects.
Cheers

I think this use case is fulfilled by carla/carla-rack. It does pull in more dependencies though.

[Luc]

I have two strong reasons to prefer standalone Rakarrack:

1) Not only is Rakarrack a very nice collection of effects, but also I can wedge it between output and input and add/remove or enable/disable effects to my heart's content and that wedge between output and input never goes away and nothing gets broken.

In Carla, whenever I disable or mute an effect, the entire chain is muted, and whenever I want to add an effect, I have to disconnect at least two input channels and two output channels, add the plugin, then connect two input channels and two output channels. Repeat that for as many plugins as intended.

2) Even worse, the Rakarrack plugins do not work in Tracktion (what I have been using instead of Ardour or Audacity). Tracktion does not load LV2 plugins. When I try to use Carla, weird things happen.

On Carla Rack: one Rakarrack plugin loads and the meters light up, but... where is the effect??? Nowhere to be heard. I tweak everything I can and the sound still is the same, as if the plugin were bypassed/disabled.
If I load another Rakarrack plugin, everything gets muted. If I remove the second plugin, sound is restored (but still effect-less). If I remove the first plugin instead of the second, it remains mute.

On Carla Patchbay: everything gets mute immediately and nothing seems to fix it.

So standalone Rakarrack is in fact my only choice.

[Luc]

I just tried it all again on Ardour. Ardour can load the LV2 plugins directly, but if I load them through Carla Rack or Patchbay, I get the same problems I get with Tracktion.

[tatch]

I have two strong reasons to prefer standalone Rakarrack:

1) Not only is Rakarrack a very nice collection of effects, but also I can wedge it between output and input and add/remove or enable/disable effects to my heart's content and that wedge between output and input never goes away and nothing gets broken.

In Carla, whenever I disable or mute an effect, the entire chain is muted, and whenever I want to add an effect, I have to disconnect at least two input channels and two output channels, add the plugin, then connect two input channels and two output channels. Repeat that for as many plugins as intended.

2) Even worse, the Rakarrack plugins do not work in Tracktion (what I have been using instead of Ardour or Audacity). Tracktion does not load LV2 plugins. When I try to use Carla, weird things happen.

On Carla Rack: one Rakarrack plugin loads and the meters light up, but... where is the effect??? Nowhere to be heard. I tweak everything I can and the sound still is the same, as if the plugin were bypassed/disabled.
If I load another Rakarrack plugin, everything gets muted. If I remove the second plugin, sound is restored (but still effect-less). If I remove the first plugin instead of the second, it remains mute.

On Carla Patchbay: everything gets mute immediately and nothing seems to fix it.

So standalone Rakarrack is in fact my only choice.

I think this also makes a case for improving the lv2 plugins so they can be made to work in those programs. You do have a point about muting, it's discussed more here https://github.com/falkTX/Carla/issues/52

[folderol]

Plugins don't suit my workflow at all so I'd hope to see standalone Rakarrack kept up. I don't use it a lot - cos I don't play guitar much, but I do also use it for some vocal processing, and very occasionally harmonica!

[ssj71]

i'm fairly repulsed by the standalone gui

I like the rakarrack gui

regardless of my choice, the rakarrack GUI would not be changing. So thats a non-issue.

I would say 'use your precious spare time exactly the way you want to', and not worry about us consumers.

I wish everyone had that attitude. I do however think its worth asking around and if I'm happy working on either thing especially it makes sense to work on what others want. I start feeling guilty though when I think that this could be a forking point of code when I'd rather have it be an improvement of both projects. But better one project move forward than 2 stay stagnant.

this use case is fulfilled by carla/carla-rack

+1

1)...

as falk commented, this is just a small issue in carla, will be resolved.

2) Even worse, the Rakarrack plugins do not work in Tracktion...

I see this (as tatch mentioned) as all the more reason to leave the standalone as it is (you can keep using it without trouble) and focus on making the plugins work.

So standalone Rakarrack is in fact my only choice.

I didn't mean to ask which one is more useful right now. I would rather know which you would rather use, a working plugin or a working standalone.

I think it's fair to expect the rakarrack devs to import that code now.

Thanks for the thought and assurance as always!
On this, AFAIK, one of the original devs really didn't want to see forks (which I understand) the other was more open to the idea, but he doesn't have much time to put into it anymore either.

Plugins don't suit my workflow at all so I'd hope to see standalone Rakarrack kept up

Well, most likely the standalone will remain exactly the same as it is/was. Rackarrack is a plugin host more or less. As lv2 hosts continue to improve I think we'll find more and more that we can use them as a 1-to-1 workflow replacement for the standalone.

So I think I'll let Transmogrifox know that I'll be happy to advise on a merge, but I'm not going to finish it.
Thanks everyone for your thoughts.