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Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:14 pm
by mendo
See:

  • https://www.bitwig.com/en/bitwig-studio/bitwig-studio-3.html
  • https://downloads-eu.bitwig.com/stable/3.0/Release-Notes-3.0.html

The second page reads:
Reworked audio backends: ASIO & WASAPI (PC), CoreAudio (macOS), ALSA & PulseAudio (Linux), and Jack (everyone)


Question to the experienced Bitwig users here:
Does it also fix the known MIDI issues?

Thanks for a feedback.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:23 pm
by jonetsu
mendo wrote: Does it also fix the known MIDI issues?


MIDI issues ? Such as ?

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:24 am
by khz
MIDI with or in jack?
In qjackctl Bitwig has been recognized.
Test yourself. Download Bitwig demo. Unpack "bitwig-studio-3.0.deb", unpack "data.tar.xz" and click on "Bitwig-3.0/opt/bitwig-studio/bitwig-studio" to start Bitwig without installing.

But in Bitwig Settings/Audio: "Warning: this driver model is not suitable for real-time syncronisation (MIDI Clock and Ableton Link).

<EDIT>Maybe: Rename old settings in your ~home directory:

Code: Select all

mv .program_name .program_name-BAK
</EDIT>

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:31 pm
by khz
khz wrote:In qjackctl Bitwig has been recognized.

Correction: MIDI is not recognized.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:15 pm
by jonetsu
khz wrote:Correction: MIDI is not recognized.

Do you mean that you cannot use a MIDI keyboard with Bitwig ?

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:17 am
by khz
I haven't found any MIDI inputs/outputs function in Bitwig nor do I see any Bitwig MIDI I/O in qjackctl (a2jmidid - neither in jack nor alsa).

At the first start I thought I saw a MIDI I/O from Bitwig in qjackctl.
This was probably a mistake or I may have now a wrong Bitwig setting. Maybe it is also a Bitwig operating error on my part.

Without the Bitwig MIDI entries in qjackctl I wouldn't know how to route MIDI to external software or hardware programs/devices.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:02 am
by lilith
Same for me. I don't understand how that works, but my midi keyboard works.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 1:30 pm
by jonetsu
khz wrote:I haven't found any MIDI inputs/outputs function in Bitwig nor do I see any Bitwig MIDI I/O in qjackctl (a2jmidid - neither in jack nor alsa). At the first start I thought I saw a MIDI I/O from Bitwig in qjackctl. Without the Bitwig MIDI entries in qjackctl I wouldn't know how to route MIDI to external software or hardware programs/devices.


On Xubuntu and Linux Mint, Bitwig integrates right away from boot of the machine and it's rather Ardour/Mixbus that needs some special care.


bitwigMIDI.jpg



And still about Xubuntu and LM, for Mixbus the following has to be run in order to use a MIDI controller:

a2j_control ehw start

And when that has been run, going back to Bitwig means doing:

killall /usr/bin/a2jmidid

And in terms of practical regular use, one approach is:

alias A2J='a2j_control ehw start'
alias KA2J='killall /usr/bin/a2jmidid'

This is from a regular install of both of these distro, without having modified anything to the audio subsystem. If the audio is modified at installation then behaviour can be different.

In my case, since I create using Bitwig I prefer to have Bitwig flying off right away from the start and I don't mind having to execute an alias or two for Mixbus32C since mixing happens much less frequently than creation. And this is Bitwig 2.4.3 although I doubt very much that this has changed in 3.0.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:35 pm
by noedig
Bitwig's JACK support is only for audio.

For MIDI, Bitwig still uses ALSA MIDI devices directly and exclusively, i.e. you can't use a device while Bitwig is using it. Bitwig also doesn't show up in the ALSA MIDI tag in QJackCtl, MIDI configuration is done within bitwig as shown by jonetsu.

Previous discussions on this can be found here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=19707

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:00 pm
by jonetsu
That exclusive MIDI use can be a drawback in some setups although I wonder how many of those setups do exist, where one plays a synth in Bitwig using a MIDI controller and at the same time wants to play another soft synth that's not in Bitwig, with the same controller.

Maybe some grid controller (Launchpad style) that controls both a light rig for a stage as well as soft synths.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:07 am
by khz
jonetsu wrote:That exclusive MIDI use can be a drawback in some setups although I wonder how many of those setups do exist, where one plays a synth in Bitwig using a MIDI controller and at the same time wants to play another soft synth that's not in Bitwig, with the same controller.

Maybe some grid controller (Launchpad style) that controls both a light rig for a stage as well as soft synths.

I can't, because Bitwig doesn't use jackd(bus) MIDI, control my hardware ~synthesizer via MIDI or CV, or possibly control other audio programs/synthesizers via MIDI.

But I can understand Bitwig's decision if it has something to do with it: RT MIDI https://linuxmusicians.com/viewtopic.php?p=99769#p99769.

Nevertheless I would like it if Bitwig would optionally offer MIDI (and CV) via jackd(bus), even if the MIDI (and CV) might have worse latencies or the MIDI (and CV) would become more unstable.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:09 pm
by Linuxmusician01
jonetsu wrote:[...]And still about Xubuntu and LM, for Mixbus the following has to be run in order to use a MIDI controller:

Code: Select all

a2j_control ehw start

And when that has been run, going back to Bitwig means doing:

Code: Select all

killall /usr/bin/a2jmidid



Wow! That first command starts Alsa to Jack bridging by starting a2jmidid and enables export of hardware ports. The second command kills a2jmidid again. Very confusing to me. If a2jmidid is stopped, is the export of hardware ports still enabled then?

noedig wrote:[...] Bitwig also doesn't show up in the ALSA MIDI tag in QJackCtl, MIDI configuration is done within bitwig as shown by jonetsu.

Wow! Again, confusing. Usually Linuxers (well, at least I do) control those Midi connections via qjackctl.If Bitwig doesn't show up in said utility it'll be pretty darn hard for the average Linuxer to manage Midi in combination w/ Bitwig. Would be a reason for me to never use that DAW.

[Maybe off topic] What is so much better about Bitwig that Bitwig-on-Linux users would accept this somewhat unusual behavior? Is Ardour so very different form Bitwig? Is Qtractor not acceptable? Do other DAW's have less functionality? Worse workflow? :?:

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 1:57 pm
by jonetsu
Linuxmusician01 wrote:
jonetsu wrote:[...]And still about Xubuntu and LM, for Mixbus the following has to be run in order to use a MIDI controller:

Code: Select all

a2j_control ehw start

And when that has been run, going back to Bitwig means doing:

Code: Select all

killall /usr/bin/a2jmidid



Wow! That first command starts Alsa to Jack bridging by starting a2jmidid and enables export of hardware ports. The second command kills a2jmidid again. Very confusing to me. If a2jmidid is stopped, is the export of hardware ports still enabled then?

The first command is necessary to run before Mixbus/Ardour when a MIDI device is used, for instance a Faderport controller.

And once mixing using Mixbus32C is done, then to go back to Bitwig, it has to come back to the Xubuntu system default.

I do not export any hardware port, I do not even have any use case for doing so, so I can't tell. In my use, the hardware (MIDI controller) are simply stopping at the DAW, they are not going any further or put to any other, simultaneous, use.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:01 pm
by jonetsu
khz wrote: I can't, because Bitwig doesn't use jackd(bus) MIDI, control my hardware ~synthesizer via MIDI or CV, or possibly control other audio programs/synthesizers via MIDI.


While still having no idea about why MIDI controllers could be used to control both soft synths inside a DAW and other things at the same time that are outside of the DAW, I'd say that for the CV part, it should be working under Linux as I haven't seen any warnings from Bitwig that it does not, for such a main feature.

Re: Bitwig Studio 3.0 is out now.

Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 6:38 pm
by Linuxmusician01
jonetsu wrote:
Linuxmusician01 wrote:
jonetsu wrote:[...]And still about Xubuntu and LM, for Mixbus the following has to be run in order to use a MIDI controller:

Code: Select all

a2j_control ehw start

And when that has been run, going back to Bitwig means doing:

Code: Select all

killall /usr/bin/a2jmidid



Wow! That first command starts Alsa to Jack bridging by starting a2jmidid and enables export of hardware ports. The second command kills a2jmidid again. Very confusing to me. If a2jmidid is stopped, is the export of hardware ports still enabled then?

The first command is necessary to run before Mixbus/Ardour when a MIDI device is used, for instance a Faderport controller.

And once mixing using Mixbus32C is done, then to go back to Bitwig, it has to come back to the Xubuntu system default.

I do not export any hardware port, I do not even have any use case for doing so, so I can't tell. In my use, the hardware (MIDI controller) are simply stopping at the DAW, they are not going any further or put to any other, simultaneous, use.

Okay. The option "ehw" in the command that you posted stands for "enable export of hardware ports". So that's why I assumed that you wanted to export hardware ports. And if I understand correctly then you need the following command so Mixbus can work with Jack Midi (instead of Alsa Midi):

Code: Select all

a2j_control ehw start

And when you start to use Bitwig one needs to stop the a2jmidid bridging daemon? Why? Doesn't Bitwig work if Jack Midi is "activated"?