AV Linux MX Edition Release Candidate Uploaded!

[GMaq]

Hi LM's

There has been a Release candidate of AV Linux MX Edition (aka AVL-MXE) uploaded for TESTING, it should be looked at as PROTOTYPE and not for serious production because I am not finished working on it yet. I also am busy AF right now offline so I'm putting this up to get some feedback and as a preview of what can be expected for the next AV Linux release. There is also a draft of the new AVL-MXE User Manual..

Highlights:

Based on MX Linux 19.2 "patito feo"
Great 'MX-Tools" including their Installer (sooooo much better than Systemback)
AV Linux Kernel with full RT Preemption
Totally reworked AVL-MXE Assistant
Ardour 6.3
Mixbus 32C 6.1.22 Demo
Odin2! *not the LV2 version yet!
Hydrogen 1.0.0
Geonkick
Latest B-Plugins
New but VERY incomplete Audio Assault Demos *waiting for more demo versions to be provided by Vendor
Harrison-AVA Demos *note only working on Linux with certain OpenGL versions!
LinVST 3.1
Avidemux, Blender, Cinelerra-GG and Olive for Video folks
Lots of stuff, just check it out!

NEW MANUAL DRAFT: http://bandshed.net/pdf/AVL-MXE-2020.9. ... Manual.pdf
RELEASE CANDIDATE ISO: http://download.linuxaudio.org/avlinux/AVL-MXE/

[lykwydchykyn]

Hi GMaq,

I've been rebuilding my DAW the last few days using the current AVLinux, so I thought I'd give this a shot (at least live) and give you some feedback.

Couple of disclaimers first, so you know where I'm coming from:

- I've been using Linux a looooong time, so naturally I have some well-established opinions.
- My previous build was on Arch, and I'm a bit on-the-fence about using a prebuilt system. Mainly because of my established opinions, I know I'm going to want to customize any distro some, and prebuilts have fallen apart on me in the past.
- Mostly, I just care about having Ardour and a fair number of good plugins. Hydrogen and Guitarix are fun to play with, but not essential for me. Most of the rest of what AVLinux offers isn't stuff I use.
- Just gonna check this out on live boot for now, not sure I'm ready to install.

Visuals / First impressions

I am not a huge fan of XFCE, though I would agree it's a sensible choice for a DAW. I appreciate the minimal approach you take on the desktop, but personally I like a panel that gives me better feedback on what's currently running. These dock-type panels confuse me. I may try to get accustomed to it, but I'm an old dog. I think I'd try to stick with this desktop for a bit, but I might just install MATE instead.

I do like the conky on the default desktop; with an older machine, I like to keep an eye on the resource usage as I'm adding plugins. Only problem is that on my laptop screen (1366x768) it intersects with the panel and creates some clutter. You might consider jamming that thing to the top, or removing non-essential items like the running kernel or hostname.

As a small detail, when you plug in a second monitor, you get a generic XFCE desktop background that doesn't match the rest of the theme. If you can make it so that the default background is the same on all monitors, it would look a little slicker (I mean, I'm gonna change the background anyway, but just in the interest of looking pro for people trying it out on dual monitors).

Software

Jack works fine, I was able to get my latency down to 5.8ms just like on the installed version. Ardour works great, was able to load up my current projects and play back without crashes (yet? I have a history of crashes with Ardour). One of my larger projects wouldn't play back any sound, not really sure what was up with that. May have to re-copy that one from my old DAW.

I did notice that ardour is not installed from repo packages; is there going to be a way to update it when a new version is released, or are we on our own for that?

Also, I just bought a paid version of Ardour, is there any difference between what you pre-load and the paid version (assuming same version #'s)?

The new AV-MXE assistant looks a lot more modern. Very handy. My only gripe here is that it has a fixed height, so the bottom gets cut off on the 1366x768 screen and it won't maximize. On a 1400x900 screen, it's fine.

Regarding the browser update tools -- are the browsers not installed from the repos?

Hardware

One thing I've had a problem with on my current AVL install is the touchpad. Can't get scrolling to work, and I've been through every forum/reddit post, wiki page, and github issue I could find on the subject. On the new version the touchpad works perfectly out of the box.

The WIFI, though, does not. It's a BCM43224, not detected out of the box (Confound you Broadcom!). Guessing I need to get one of the b43 drivers or some such, I never looked what it was using on the old system as it just worked. It does find the bluetooth, and dmesg shows that it's loading bcma. I'm sure that's fixable after install, I've dealt with broadcom errors before.

Audio/Video-wise, everything seems peachy.

I can totally see myself using this. As long as I can find all the plugins I need, I think settling in to a more stable distro would suit me well. Great Work!

[gennargiu]

Hi Glenn,great work, i tested new avlinux mx edition on boxes virtual machine. For me is all ok

gennaro

[GMaq]

Hi GMaq,

I've been rebuilding my DAW the last few days using the current AVLinux, so I thought I'd give this a shot (at least live) and give you some feedback.

Couple of disclaimers first, so you know where I'm coming from:

- I've been using Linux a looooong time, so naturally I have some well-established opinions.
- My previous build was on Arch, and I'm a bit on-the-fence about using a prebuilt system. Mainly because of my established opinions, I know I'm going to want to customize any distro some, and prebuilts have fallen apart on me in the past.
- Mostly, I just care about having Ardour and a fair number of good plugins. Hydrogen and Guitarix are fun to play with, but not essential for me. Most of the rest of what AVLinux offers isn't stuff I use.
- Just gonna check this out on live boot for now, not sure I'm ready to install.

Hi LC! Thanks for the feedback and kicking the tires! Understood, my own workflow is similar. 72.7% of AVL I don't use either... it's there to cover various use cases..

Visuals / First impressions

I am not a huge fan of XFCE, though I would agree it's a sensible choice for a DAW. I appreciate the minimal approach you take on the desktop, but personally I like a panel that gives me better feedback on what's currently running. These dock-type panels confuse me. I may try to get accustomed to it, but I'm an old dog. I think I'd try to stick with this desktop for a bit, but I might just install MATE instead.

Yep.. right-click on the Panel Panel--->Panel preferences--->Go wild! I'd hate to lose Thunar with all the Custom Action Goodies but you do you..

I do like the conky on the default desktop; with an older machine, I like to keep an eye on the resource usage as I'm adding plugins. Only problem is that on my laptop screen (1366x768) it intersects with the panel and creates some clutter. You might consider jamming that thing to the top, or removing non-essential items like the running kernel or hostname.

Meh... The Conky is new.. something you can never get right... Too big for you... then the guy with the 4K monitor is like Dude! Whats with the microscopic text on the Conky!!?? lol. I actually have a sacrificial lamb laptop that belonged to my daughter with that same screen res as that. I just experimented and changing the Conky text size to 'Arial=8' seemed to make it an acceptable size. The MX-Tools have a great Conky Editor app BTW

As a small detail, when you plug in a second monitor, you get a generic XFCE desktop background that doesn't match the rest of the theme. If you can make it so that the default background is the same on all monitors, it would look a little slicker (I mean, I'm gonna change the background anyway, but just in the interest of looking pro for people trying it out on dual monitors).

Hmmm Drat! Thought I had that set properly..

Software

Jack works fine, I was able to get my latency down to 5.8ms just like on the installed version. Ardour works great, was able to load up my current projects and play back without crashes (yet? I have a history of crashes with Ardour). One of my larger projects wouldn't play back any sound, not really sure what was up with that. May have to re-copy that one from my old DAW.

I did notice that ardour is not installed from repo packages; is there going to be a way to update it when a new version is released, or are we on our own for that?

Also, I just bought a paid version of Ardour, is there any difference between what you pre-load and the paid version (assuming same version #'s)?

The new AV-MXE assistant looks a lot more modern. Very handy. My only gripe here is that it has a fixed height, so the bottom gets cut off on the 1366x768 screen and it won't maximize. On a 1400x900 screen, it's fine.

Regarding the browser update tools -- are the browsers not installed from the repos?

Yes I only ship Ardours own fully paid bundle.. that way you get tech support otherwise Ardour devs are pretty reticent about supporting anybody's Distro packaging.. Want to update? Download an updated Paid version from Ardour (sounds like you already are a subscriber) OR install the Ardour version from the included KXStudio repos and roll the dice..

Yes I need to make that Assistant scrollable.... still learning my GTKDialog skills

Yes the one-button Browser Updates are for the terminally lazy, Certainly you could open Synaptic, Reload, search that browser name and update only the Browser... or you can bang open a Root terminal an apt-get update and apt-get install. It's just a convenience thing...

Hardware

One thing I've had a problem with on my current AVL install is the touchpad. Can't get scrolling to work, and I've been through every forum/reddit post, wiki page, and github issue I could find on the subject. On the new version the touchpad works perfectly out of the box.

The WIFI, though, does not. It's a BCM43224, not detected out of the box (Confound you Broadcom!). Guessing I need to get one of the b43 drivers or some such, I never looked what it was using on the old system as it just worked. It does find the bluetooth, and dmesg shows that it's loading bcma. I'm sure that's fixable after install, I've dealt with broadcom errors before.

Ahh yes, touchpads...HATE THEM!! Have you tried commenting out 'options psmouse proto=imps' in /etc/modprobe.d/touchpad.conf?

If you mean Broadcom on the MX version, they have a great tool called " MX-Network Assistant".. Open it, go to 'Linux Drivers' try unblocking and loading 'brcmsmac' and see if that works..

Audio/Video-wise, everything seems peachy.

I can totally see myself using this. As long as I can find all the plugins I need, I think settling in to a more stable distro would suit me well. Great Work!

[GMaq]

Hi Glenn,great work, i tested new avlinux mx edition on boxes virtual machine. For me is all ok

gennaro

Thanks Gennaro!!

[lykwydchykyn]

Yep.. right-click on the Panel Panel--->Panel preferences--->Go wild! I'd hate to lose Thunar with all the Custom Action Goodies but you do you..

I just read on the custom actions, that's worth keeping XFCE for. I don't really hate XFCE, it's just always kinda meh to me.

Meh... The Conky is new.. something you can never get right... Too big for you... then the guy with the 4K monitor is like Dude! Whats with the microscopic text on the Conky!!?? lol. I actually have a sacrificial lamb laptop that belonged to my daughter with that same screen res as that. I just experimented and changing the Conky text size to 'Arial=8' seemed to make it an acceptable size. The MX-Tools have a great Conky Editor app BTW

Fair enough; conky is a fussy but lovable beast.

Yes I only ship Ardours own fully paid bundle.. that way you get tech support otherwise Ardour devs are pretty reticent about supporting anybody's Distro packaging.. Want to update? Download an updated Paid version from Ardour (sounds like you already are a subscriber) OR install the Ardour version from the included KXStudio repos and roll the dice..

I just paid for it for the first time today; figured I ought to have by now anyway. I would use the version that ships with AVL, but I already have ardour6 sessions that I need to work on. No going back now.

Ahh yes, touchpads...HATE THEM!! Have you tried commenting out 'options psmouse proto=imps' in /etc/modprobe.d/touchpad.conf?

I had, and I know I rebooted at least 8 times afterwards... but after testing the beta and booting back to my install, the TP works. Weird. I'll take it, though.

If you mean Broadcom on the MX version, they have a great tool called " MX-Network Assistant".. Open it, go to 'Linux Drivers' try unblocking and loading 'brcmsmac' and see if that works..

I'll give it a shot.

Hey I read in the manual also that you started out on Mepis. I started out with it as well, used it from around 04 through 08 or so and practically lived on mepislovers forums during that time. I wrote a lot of the manual for version 7, though I don't know that I got any credit for it. It was good times, but I bailed out eventually when I got a system at work that wouldn't run mepis. That was a great distro, good times.

[sunrat]

Nice work Glen! I'm just kicking the tyres as my Buster/KDE system is working better than anything I've used before as I have mentioned to you previously so I likely won't be switching to AVL-MXE. So just a few observations. I used MX-16 for about 18 months as my primary system but prefer Debian and have grown to like Xfce less over time.
First, the colours. I can see the appeal and it looks like you have integrated the theme well, but I find colours distract from doing things. The default MX dark theme is good, as is KDE Breeze Dark which I use now. I would prefer to have the colours as an option but stick with MX default OOTB. Xfce is still bad on my 4K monitor. It needs fractional scaling like KDE; 2x is too big and some windows don't respect the scaling anyway. I remember jumping through some hoops and getting it acceptable in MX and should be possible with AVL-MXE but I wasn't going to bother doing that for a quick live USB boot. MX persistence should help if using live boot regularly. I can't imagine using Ardour or Mixbus on a 1366x768 screen. I have a small laptop with that resolution and cringe at even web browsing on that.
Conky needs to be tweaked for each system; on mine it showed 2 cores of 4 for cpu, and didn't show network although ethernet was connected. Best stick with MX default again IMO.
I need a panel to see open windows and programs. Dock is confusing as I don't know what half the icons are and there is no popup info for rollover.
Audio was tricky. ALSA worked OK but level was set default at sixty-something percent. I played an audio file in Clementine which itself defaults to 50% so sound was really quiet for starters. JACK wouldn't start but I'm used to that. I always need conf files in /etc/modprobe.d/ to set my M2496 to be primary card and blacklist HDMI sound. MX Select Sound didn't help with this.
Now for the good stuff. I loaded a fresh Ardour project (with ALSA), imported files, and did some quick mixing. Very smooth experience with low DSP usage.
Played some music in Clementine, all sweet there. Watched a local video file in MPV, also good.
Your custom utilities are nice. Good selection of default applications. I used AVL for several years for production and still have 2019 (or 2018?) installed and boot it occasionally for some of the special features. But I've drifted from Xfce, and from MX for a few other reasons so I'm wishing you could have stayed with a Debian base. And congratulations on fitting it all into 3.1GB. I tried making a snapshot of a tentative MX-KDE based audio distro with somewhat less features than yours and it ended up 3.8GB.
But overall it's coming along nicely! I may not use AVL as my no.1 production system any more, but my current setup borrows most of its DNA from your work so I'm eternally grateful.

[Robin Cherry]

Looking forward to this!

I'm curious which wine version you were planning?

[Rodney]

That's great! I was waiting for this one, testing now.

Huge thanks in advance dear Gmaq!

[Rodney]

Dear Glenn,

I tried only the Live session and wow, it's great! Super lightweight and apparent very stable! Ardour 6 sounds great and I love the yellow look, beautiful. Unfortunately many plugins are missing from the live session, I couldn't even find Audio assault plugins. Do I have to install AVL in order to find all the plugins? The only bug I found so far is that in order to maximize Ardour's window, you have to edit the Panel preferences and choose at Automatically hide the panel: "Always".

Needless to say, great job!

Cheers,

Rodney

[GMaq]

@sunrat

I appreciate the tire kicking! As far as the default theme... meh I don't know what I think, I'm sooooo tired of blue and grey 'business' themes and I want AVL to appear as something unique.. all of this stuff is subjective and the Manual explains pretty clearly how to get rolling with XFCE4 and make changes. I take your point and understand your point but I've never tried or installed any Distro in my life that I haven't customized within 5 minutes.. If a potential user isn't willing to get past themes and wallpapers then I hope they move on to something else to be honest, that stuff is just lipstick that is easily changed. Same goes for the Dock panel... there is a 'Window Menu' in the Panel to show what windows are open BTW, but like everything else Panels are a personal preference... Right click and bend it to your will

Yes conky will fail if it has more cores enabled than the system has present so that's why there are only 2 cores in the initial default conky.

If you don't mind telling me... my highest res monitor is 1920x1200 but the AV Linux 'Earth' Materia and Oomox themes were created with 'HiDPI' assets, would you mind verifying if XFCE4's appearance is improved with the Materia or Oomox themes?

AVL-MXE is spun off a hardware system here, its possible my default ALSA Mixer settings are low so I will check that..

Again thanks for your feedback!
@Robin Cherry

Hi! Wine-staging is not pinned so is the latest version... either 5.17 or 5.18 I think, also LinVST is at 3.1.

@Rodney

Hey there, thanks for your limitless enthusiasm, it is a day brightener!

Did you run a VST scan in Ardour? To be honest the amount of Plugins in AV Linux 2020 was approaching the ridiculous so so far AVL-MXE is on a bit of a Plugin diet.. I'm shooting for the best known and most popular stuff, anything else should be in Synaptic..

A full VST scan in Ardour should be showing Sigma and FreakQ from Audio Assault, I have spoken to Enrique about more demos but they are very invested in finishing ReAmp right now and they don't have very many Demo versions of their more popular Plugins on the website yet..

[Rodney]

Yes! Now after the scan, the plugins showed up, thanks Glenn! Concerning the plugins, my computer is not connected to the internet, so if all the plugins in AVL2020 end up in the MX edition as well, I'd appreciate that a lot. Only if possible, of course.

Big, huge thanks for your splendid work, it's worth a million!

Att.: Rodney

[GMaq]

Yes! Now after the scan, the plugins showed up, thanks Glenn! Concerning the plugins, my computer is not connected to the internet, so if all the plugins in AVL2020 end up in the MX edition as well, I'd appreciate that a lot. Only if possible, of course.

Big, huge thanks for your splendid work, it's worth a million!

Att.: Rodney

Hmm to narrow it down a little and maybe meet in the middle what Plugins are you missing the most? Bear in Mind if you ran Ubuntu Studio or Librazik or any other Audio spin live you would also be missing some Plugins..

[Rodney]

The ones I like to use, besides guitarix plugins of course: Modulay, Shiroverb, Abgate, Barry satan´s maximizer, EricSound plugins (FreeeQ & UniQ), Roomy(reverb), Klangfalter, calf plugins in general are great, distrho plugins and its ports as well as x42 plugins, specially the Equalizer, they are all great! DrowAudio is also amazing and I really like NoiseRepellent. AVLdrumkits are killer! Anyway I don´t wanna bother at all, I think I can just copy and paste from AVL2020´s LV2 folder, I think it´s gonna work .

Thanks a bunch again for all your hardwork dear Glenn, I´ll install the RC this weekend to test it further and report back to you

Cheers,

Rodney

[sunrat]

If you don't mind telling me... my highest res monitor is 1920x1200 but the AV Linux 'Earth' Materia and Oomox themes were created with 'HiDPI' assets, would you mind verifying if XFCE4's appearance is improved with the Materia or Oomox themes?

I just booted up my AVL-MXE stick again to check this. Changing theme didn't make much difference so I had to wind my brain back to when I used MX regularly to remember the tricks.
MX now has a neat xrandr tweak in MX Tweak to scale the display so I set that at 1.50. Then the main remaining problem is the border grab handles are very tiny so it's really difficult to resize windows. This can also be fixed in MX Tweak by changing style to Default-xhdpi in the Window Manager section. These 2 tweaks improve the 4K screen experience exponentially.