Linux music as a major player...

[StudioDave]

That much might even save Guitar Center's ass

You, sir, are an incorrigible optimist.



Best,

dp

[glowrak guy]

I also do a pretty mean pot of rice and beans, when there is good firewood in camp

[diizy]

Socially, there is a large throng of young, but unemployable 'every child deserves a trophy' kids.
They have not maximised their opportunities in school, have been raised in relative luxury, and sadly,

Damn kids today...

- Every generation ever

[glowrak guy]

Every generation ever? We've had 35 years of home computers,15 years of internet available to common folk.
Printing began circa the T'ang dynasty. Clearly these are unprecedented times. Never before has the world seen
such successful mass indoctrination, transcending centuries of culture, re-writing history based on whims,
herding students into heavily censored intellectual vacuums, maintained by the elites of media.

Does such an intellectual vacuum perpetuate the dominant use of Pro Tools in studios?
Have you ever asked a group of teens if they know where you could buy linux?
This generation graduating k-12 are uniquely enabled to accept both failure, and
dependance on government handouts, as normal life. And they will vote for their providers,
rather than the freedom that allows one to both fail, and succeed, on their own.

I turned on the local pop radio station last night, and was staggered by the mediocrity.
Vapid lyrics, repeated with some newish dullard effects added to each repetition,
to mask the redundancy, performed by some casting couch squeaky voiced teen heart-throb,
who makes Britney and Shakira seem like Rhodes Scholars...

[kawliga]

Socially, there is a large throng of young, but unemployable 'every child deserves a trophy' kids.
They have not maximised their opportunities in school, have been raised in relative luxury, and sadly,are devoid of a work ethic, and risk to them has not been a learned survival skill. Welfare states only coddle them, and make the situation worse, by taxing the finances of the workforce, while securing a huge welfare voting block, attempting to insure the perpetuity of the welfare state. There are 92 million working age adults in the U.S. alone, who are not working, or even actively seeking work

Remember the issues of piracy that now plague both artists and developers? People that feel entitled, demand, or steal their freebies. Foodstamps, Section 8 housing, multiple years of unemployment benefits,
work requirements stripped from Welfare eligibility, taxpayer subsidized health insurance premiums, and now, de facto amnesty, and sanctuary municipalities, for untold throngs of illegal aliens, that were actively recruited by the king's 'dream act'.

Some perspective, lets imagine that 80 million of the 92 million unemployed working age Americans, got full time jobs, at $15 per hour. That would be $2 TRILLION, 400 BILLION dollars in wages. On TOP of the existing U.S. economy. That much might even save Guitar Center's ass

Hi glowrak guy,

Hope you are well.

I think you have made some very perceptive comments about audio and you clearly have a lot of knowledge of audio and are a valuable member of the forum. However, with all due respect, this is an audio forum - it is not a political forum and not everyone on here shares your political opinions or cares to hear your political opinions. I'm all for free speech and if you want to discuss such things with others thats great but I really do think it would be better if you did so in a separate thread or something.

I do not really want to be drawn into a political argument with you, so I'll just say my piece now briefly and then hopefully, we can get back to discussing audio.

I do not accept your premise that unemployment is down to laziness - last I heard autostatic and falkTX were unemployed, but I wouldn't describe either of these people as lazy - the contributions both have made to linux audio shows tremendous energy on their part.

The reality is that people are victims of forces beyond their control. My father worked in a factory for 30 years until they closed the factory one day and my father and thousands of others were made redundant. Do you think the workforce decided to close the factory because they had all become lazy and couldn't be bothered working anymore? Do you think my father decided one day after 30 years of continuous full time employment that he would become lazy and live a life of "luxury" below the breadline on state benefits? Give me a break.

I suppose you would have us believe that in 1929, all of a sudden millions of people around the world just happened to become lazy overnight and this is what caused the unemployment of the 1930s and the Wall Street Crash was purely coincidental.

I would like to reiterate that I find your audio related comments helpful and insightful and I look forwards to reading more audio related posts from you in future. I just think that if you want to talk about politics that it would be better if you considered doing so in a separate thread or something so that those who wish to debate these things with you can do so whilst the rest of us can stick to discussing audio.

Best wishes pal. Take care,

kawliga

[raboof]

Hi glowrak guy,

Hope you are well.

I think you have made some very perceptive comments about audio and you clearly have a lot of knowledge of audio and are a valuable member of the forum. However, with all due respect, this is an audio forum - it is not a political forum

Agreed, thanks.

I do not really want to be drawn into a political argument with you, so I'll just say my piece now briefly

Your post would have been stronger without this response to the off-topic parts of the thread - but I know it's hard to resist.

[GMaq]

hehe..

A non-politcal observation...

A couple of years ago a friend who is the placement guy in a well-established private Audio recording school asked me to come in and do a lecture on recording with FLOSS because in his estimation a large number of the students had student loans and would not be able to afford setting up a Pro-Tools or Logic based studio when graduating so they may be interested on other software options...

I spent a week preparing a non-comparitive lecture on the strengths of FLOSS without getting into petty direct comparisons with Win/OSX, I entered the lecture hall to about 50 students with their glowing white Macbook Pro Apple logos facing me.. not even a Windows laptop in the house! Even the poorest of students already had a Macbook and Pro-Tools so although the kids were super polite and found certain aspects of FLOSS interesting not one of them had any actual need of 'Free' software...

I don't know what the take-away is from this, all I know is I lost my lecturing gig after that..

[StudioDave]

... I entered the lecture hall to about 50 students with their glowing white Macbook Pro Apple logos facing me.. not even a Windows laptop in the house! Even the poorest of students already had a Macbook and Pro-Tools...

Probably because they were forced to purchase them. I believe that's the case for Full Sail, possibly likewise for the Berklee College. Students are required to make the purchase, they get a student discount for the hardware and software.

No problem, it's all included with the student loan.

Best,

dp

[glowrak guy]

hehe..

A non-politcal observation...

A couple of years ago a friend who is the placement guy in a well-established private Audio recording school asked me to come in and do a lecture on recording with FLOSS because in his estimation a large number of the students had student loans and would not be able to afford setting up a Pro-Tools or Logic based studio when graduating so they may be interested on other software options...

I spent a week preparing a non-comparitive lecture on the strengths of FLOSS without getting into petty direct comparisons with Win/OSX, I entered the lecture hall to about 50 students with their glowing white Macbook Pro Apple logos facing me.. not even a Windows laptop in the house! Even the poorest of students already had a Macbook and Pro-Tools so although the kids were super polite and found certain aspects of FLOSS interesting not one of them had any actual need of 'Free' software...

I don't know what the take-away is from this, all I know is I lost my lecturing gig after that..

I wonder how many schools requiring high-end Mac laptops exist outside the U.S. and Europe?
One strength of linux audio, is it can enable some very poor, but still talented artists, to access high quality audio production tools,
who probably don't have i7 vintage hardware, but posses great desire to learn, and create.
A poor student in the U.S., may be extremely wealthy compared to student in the 3rd world,
and share identical dreams of producing music. Discussing linux audio becoming a major player, without understanding
the $environment variables, will be futile. Money matters, so the politics that effectively determine who has it,
also matters.

One day my son saw dozens of high-end Apple boxes at the schools recycle bin. They dropped
50 $large on computers that the Spielbergs would use in the rendering farms of the day, not to run the DOS level math drills
they were used for in the school.* But the property tax man soon came around, raising the rates,
even though the real estate market values had tanked.

To imagine this local $political$ decision had no effect on local music production, would make a good rap theme.
But sending the local powers an ever increasing sum, to sustain their ever increasing self-approved benefits,
hurt the audio-production market. I know that since I started with linux, I've saved a couple $hundred on oem
operating systems, and more than that, by not having to upgrade hardware every couple of years.

I'm curious if your friend at the school, was part of the procurement committee?
It would be shocking to imagine that any perks changed hands on a mere 3/4 $million worth of laptops...

*the tax insanity has driven so many people out, that the school of 1500 students, had to be closed,
and it wasn't the only one. Two guesses as to whether the taxes went up, or down?
Cheers

[glowrak guy]

... I entered the lecture hall to about 50 students with their glowing white Macbook Pro Apple logos facing me.. not even a Windows laptop in the house! Even the poorest of students already had a Macbook and Pro-Tools...

Probably because they were forced to purchase them. I believe that's the case for Full Sail, possibly likewise for the Berklee College. Students are required to make the purchase, they get a student discount for the hardware and software.

No problem, it's all included with the student loan.

Best,

dp

No worries, mate, since the gubbamint took over the student loan racket,
the loans will soon be treated just like GM, bailed out by the taxpayers, despite millions of recalls.
That should buy some votes. Bailout money either printed, or borrowed from the chicoms,
only the color of the ink is different. Either way, the grandchildren can deal with the debt.
'Not my problem' say the senators.

I imagine the entry hardware requirements at Studio Dave 101, would be friendlier?
How about the student discount?

[glowrak guy]

The reality is that people are victims of forces beyond their control.

While true, that is not the last page of the story. If one's vocation, or city, or state, or nation,
is circling the drain, it is time to move on. When people in Europe saw WWII was coming, smart families
gathered their wealth, and sent a family member abroad, so that if disaster struck,
all would not be lost. The Dust Bowl drove farmers from the midwest, to the orange groves of California.
The Depression drove children to become craftsmen, in work camps scatttered around the nation.
In modern times, the punishing taxes in New York, Illinois, and California, are driving
families and their businesses, to Texas and Florida. North Dakota is desperate for
workers, and paying high wages for those who make the sacrifice to work there.

This particular topic, can a major change occur in the audio production world,
seems to me to have a political element, because money drives politics,
business, and the pursuit of artistic dreams. There may be deep very devotions,
revealed from several perspectives, but if they are never discussed openly among the civilized,
they may end up being chanted among the barbaric.

I recognize, that such things are not central to discussions in other topics,
the purchasing of a compatible soundcard, configuring an SSD, or testing a new plugin, etc

Just for the record, I didn't call anybody lazy. A work ethic can be learned and embraced,
or mocked and rejected. It can be encouraged by leadership, or hindered with taxation and regulation.
Examples from around the world, and throughout history, do abound.
Cheers

[briandc]

The reality is that people are victims of forces beyond their control.

While true, that is not the last page of the story. If one's vocation, or city, or state, or nation,
is circling the drain, it is time to move on. When people in Europe saw WWII was coming, smart families
gathered their wealth, and sent a family member abroad, so that if disaster struck,
all would not be lost. The Dust Bowl drove farmers from the midwest, to the orange groves of California.
The Depression drove children to become craftsmen, in work camps scatttered around the nation.
In modern times, the punishing taxes in New York, Illinois, and California, are driving
families and their businesses, to Texas and Florida. North Dakota is desperate for
workers, and paying high wages for those who make the sacrifice to work there.

This particular topic, can a major change occur in the audio production world,
seems to me to have a political element, because money drives politics,
business, and the pursuit of artistic dreams. There may be deep very devotions,
revealed from several perspectives, but if they are never discussed openly among the civilized,
they may end up being chanted among the barbaric.

I recognize, that such things are not central to discussions in other topics,
the purchasing of a compatible soundcard, configuring an SSD, or testing a new plugin, etc

Just for the record, I didn't call anybody lazy. A work ethic can be learned and embraced,
or mocked and rejected. It can be encouraged by leadership, or hindered with taxation and regulation.
Examples from around the world, and throughout history, do abound.
Cheers

Definitely a multi-faceted conversation here.
I'd prefer laziness over ignorance. There are a lot of people working very hard, and only to make their bosses and CEOs richer and richer. What's the point? But if you vote for politicians who are liars and hypocrites, the joke's on you.

Here in Italy, the economic crisis is in full swing. I'm grateful I have work. I know many do not. It's not their "fault," as many did indeed get laid off due to company downsizing, etc. (Self-employment might be the best alternative!)
However, just "moving on" as you say is not realistic for most people. People tend to stay where they were raised, as you know. So when things get rough, they try to stick it out, perhaps eliminating a few "superficial" extras in their lives, maybe growing their own food to save money (and eat better!), etc. And we just wait for better times to return. (And return, they will.)

To me, the great thing about linux is not so much that it's gratis, but that it's open source, and developed and maintained by people like you and I, all over the world. I can't stress this enough.


brian

[raboof]

Definitely a multi-faceted conversation here (...) politicians who are liars and hypocrites (...) economic crisis

Ok. Let's get back on topic now though .

[diizy]

Just for the record, I didn't call anybody lazy. A work ethic can be learned and embraced,
or mocked and rejected. It can be encouraged by leadership, or hindered with taxation and regulation.
Examples from around the world, and throughout history, do abound.
Cheers

What is a "work ethic"?

To me, it means doing work in an ethical way. Any work that does not in some way make the world a better place to live is not worth doing. If the work you're doing isn't causing an overall improvement, then it's a waste of time, resources or both, which ultimately means it's actually harmful and thus not ethical.

I could make huge sums of money right now if I would just forget about my work ethic. I'm not willing to do that though... and I don't care if that earns me the label of "lazy". I think the world could use a bit more laziness.

[ssj71]

This thread was (I thought) moving towards something actionable, which would improve the state of affairs of linux audio and specifically ardour. I'm beginning to feel like all forums really don't get you much more than pages of rhetoric. :\