EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

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PieterPenninckx
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EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by PieterPenninckx »

Hi all,

I've noticed that there is concern about climate change amongst some Linuxmusicians. For the concerned (or alarmed): it may be good to know that there's a petition for a new legislation on advertisements for fossil fuels.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by asbak »

I'll just come out and say it and leave it to the insane Church of Science people and bunny-huggers to spam me with their illogical and absurd lalaland beliefs.

Here are the facts

- Everybody on this board owes his and her existence to fossil fuels.
- Everybody on this board is a carbon based lifeform.
- Everybody on this board interacts with 100's if not 1000's of their possessions on a daily basis that were made from or derived from fossil-fuel petro-chemicals.
- Everybody on this board is being fed by food grown with and harvested with fossil fuels.
- Magic electricity doesn't just jump out of the power-socket by itself. It needs to be generated.
- To generate magic electricity the only realistic options for large-scale and reliable power generation are fossil fuel plants, hydro plants and nuclear plants. Everything else is just pie-in-the-sky.
- Wind & Solar are neither reliable nor consistent generators of electricity.
- Both wind & solar have serious environmental impacts that the usual suspects conveniently forget to mention and hypocritically omit from their sanctimonious "green" demands. Both come with serious costs to the environment.
- Many if not most "green" and "environmental" organizations are being sponsored or paid by polluting billion dollar corporations and jet-setting super-rich people. Does that not seem strange, can people not smell the rat in the kitchen?


The idea that fossil fuels are the root of all evil and that they can magically (according to greens & EUrocrats) be replaced by "clean green energy" is a myth that belongs with the tooth fairy, Santa Claus and beliefs that billionaires are philanthropists.

There, I said it. That's the reality. Some may think it's harsh. Some may think it's mean. Some may think it's trolling. But it isn't. It's reality and many people nowadays are triggered by anything that doesn't align with their fairy-tale beliefs.

Once you've looked past all the nonsense from hysterical wet-rags, politicians and snake-oil sales people it's clear that "green" is not "green" at all, except to put greenbacks ( meaning $$ ) in the pockets of very rich manipulators and con-artists and to drive already 1/2 crazy populations even more insane with hysteria.

PS: There's a very good documentary film on this topic called "The Planet of the Humans" which was produced by the infamous Michael Moore. For those who still think that the "green" movement and "green" energy are for real, that should be your first wake-up call.

PPS: People who are really committed to going green better walk the walk instead of talking the talk. Talk is cheap. If you really want to go green then bye bye to electricity, clothing made from materials from the petro-chemical industry, staying warm in winter, no more food except what you grow yourself and forget about being transported to different places unless you walk. Once you have made those sacrifices, you will have gone green. Anything less is just faking it.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by Largos »

Everybody on this board owes his and her existence to fossil fuels.
I'm confused, Is sperm a fossil fuel?
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by Loki Harfagr »

Largos wrote: Sun Jan 30, 2022 6:10 pm
Everybody on this board owes his and her existence to fossil fuels.
I'm confused, Is sperm a fossil fuel?
Somehow exact, when you consider alimony, your sperm was the fuel to your fossil era (it may certainly vary re. twonkyness of local govs) :wink:
:mrgreen: :arrow:
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by asbak »

And we're off to the races with "confused" people who believe it's clever to pontificate with witticisms against the very things that their daily interactions & existence is based on.

Smart. Real smart.

if people don't like fossil fuels & petro-chemicals that's cool, but then don't be a hypocrite and benefit from and use the stuff. Walk the walk, don't talk the talk.

No means No! :mrgreen:
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by Largos »

asbak wrote: Sun Jan 30, 2022 7:41 pm And we're off to the races with "confused" people who believe it's clever to pontificate with witticisms against the very things that their daily interactions & existence is based on.

Smart. Real smart.

if people don't like fossil fuels & petro-chemicals that's cool, but then don't be a hypocrite and benefit from and use the stuff. Walk the walk, don't talk the talk.

No means No! :mrgreen:
Your black and white morality on the subject is foolish. If people have individual equal opportunity to choose how their energy, food etc is produced then you may have a point but they don't. Unless you are lucky enough to live a very niche existence, then consuming fossil fuels or something where fossil fuels were involved in production is unavoidable. To say people can't have an opinion against fossil fuels whilst using them hardly works when it's like that.

I don't think anyone is under the impression that renewable energy has zero environmental impact. Even if it has half the environmental impact fossil fuels has, that's still a progression.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by asbak »

Your black and white morality on the subject is foolish.
My opinion isn't 1/2 as foolish as your failed attempt at a response.
If people have individual equal opportunity to choose how their energy, food etc is produced then you may have a point but they don't.
Since when don't people "have a choice"? There's always a choice but hypocrites won't make that choice. Instead they "entertain" the rest of us with their green virtue signalling and fake morality.

In case you still don't get it, nobody is forcing you to use electricity and tech made possible by the petrochemical industry, wear clothing made from synthetics, make use of transport provided by fossil fuels, eat food grown with, harvested and transported to you with fossil-fuel byproducts. You most definitely have a choice not to consume any of these things.

You may not like the choice, but it exists. Change starts with you. What are you going to do about it?

Oh that's right. NOTHING. Because you pretend that "you don't have a choice".

Well sorry, but that's just a cop out. The choice is simple, walk into the jungle or the forest, turn your back on civilization and become a forager.
To say people can't have an opinion against fossil fuels whilst using them hardly works when it's like that.
To have an opinion against fossil fuels is one thing. To organize fossil fuel related bans and phase-outs go WAY beyond "having an opinion" and where this leads to is a place that the lunatics and believers in magic solutions apparently have not figured out yet.

Our entire existence is based on the same things they are campaigning against. Take that away and guess what will happen? Do I really have to spell it out?
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by Largos »

So, our existence is based on fossil fuels but we also have a choice? I think you need to decide what your point of view is.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by asbak »

Largos wrote: Sun Jan 30, 2022 9:41 pm So, our existence is based on fossil fuels but we also have a choice?
Every single poster on this board has chosen to live a fossil fuel fueled life.
If they didn't, they surely wouldn't be on the forum using their fossil fuel made computers powered by fossil fuel energy to post messages here.
That's a basic fact that appears to be lost on yourself.

We've therefore established that every poster on here is a fossil fuel user and beneficiary of fossil fuel products and live lives enabled by and made possible by fossil fuels.

Yet strangely, some people want to have their cake and eat it. They enjoy the benefits of fossil fuels and yet they lecture others that fossil fuels must be abolished. This is known as virtue signalling and hypocrisy.

Note that having the view that the fossil fuel existence is not ideal and that we must strive for something different or better is not really a problem, people are entitled to their views.

But people telling the rest of us that we must stop using the very same things they are using, and who are unwilling to make the sacrifices they are demanding for the rest of us, and who offer no viable solutions and alternatives, are scammers and delusional.

I think you need to decide what your point of view is.
My point of view is consistent and clear. I am pro fossil fuel and I make no excuses for it.
I think you need to first learn the basics about the basics before presuming to lecture others on what their point of view is.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by Largos »

Every single poster on this board has chosen to live a fossil fuel fueled life
I am sure most people here live in situations where the only reasonable way to get regular safe drinking water is by a solution where somewhere along the way fossil fuel usage is involved by some first, second, third etc party. Also, not everyone has an "option" to go choke a chicken by hand for dinner to not appear "hypocritical".
If they didn't, they surely wouldn't be on the forum using their fossil fuel made computers powered by fossil fuel energy to post messages here.
That's a basic fact that appears to be lost on yourself.
Personally, I use a 100% renewable electricity supplier.
Yet strangely, some people want to have their cake and eat it. They enjoy the benefits of fossil fuels and yet they lecture others that fossil fuels must be abolished. This is known as virtue signalling and hypocrisy.
Who has argued for that? This is about a ban on advertising for fossil fuel. It was you that came in with the long post and opinions.
Note that having the view that the fossil fuel existence is not ideal and that we must strive for something different or better is not really a problem, people are entitled to their views.
Which is the actual argument to switching from them.
My point of view is consistent and clear. I am pro fossil fuel and I make no excuses for it.
I am sure you are just pro your lifestyle and you have some irrational fear that it's going to be taken away by a change from fossil fuels.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by bluzee »

Where I live the sun barely rises above the horizon in the winter and it goes to minus 30 or 40C for several weeks. The solar panels won't even light up the patio lanterns.

In spite of that there are still massive deployments of Solar and Wind generation happening. They will never fully meet out needs, but every little bit helps.

What we are primarily focusing on is changing the way we consume fossil fuel. The hydrocarbon can be cracked in the formation and passed through specialized filters that only allow pure hydrogen to the surface. All the carbon remains in the formation exactly where it has been for hundreds of millions of years. The process is cheap, self sustaining once started and pollution free. The hydrogen can be blended into natural gas up to a 50/50 rate allowing emissions to be immediately cut by 50% without any furnace refits. Eventually this can replace natural gas entirely. It's still fossil fuel but it has zero GHG emission.

Same fuel can be used in electric generation.

Agriculture has changed to practices that have created one of the worlds largest carbon sinks.

Trees are being planted.

This is at the home of one of the world largest oil and gas deposits. If we can do it, any one can.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by asbak »

There are definitely ways to improve how we live, reduce pollution, build more efficient systems and all these kinds of efforts are commendable.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by asbak »

Largos wrote: Sun Jan 30, 2022 11:17 pm I am sure most people here live in situations where the only reasonable way to get regular safe drinking water is by a solution where somewhere along the way fossil fuel usage is involved by some first, second, third etc party. Also, not everyone has an "option" to go choke a chicken by hand for dinner to not appear "hypocritical".
You are avoiding the reality that the pro "let's start banning fossil fuels" people have a choice to change their lifestyles, and change starts with them.
It's a wonderful world these people live in. They want to keep using all the benefits of the same system they want to deny to others.

Personally, I use a 100% renewable electricity supplier.
Right there is a beautiful example of the dream green world. There is no such thing as a 100% renewable energy supplier. It's a total fantasy made up by marketers.

Magic windmills and solar panels do not generate reliable, consistently available energy and are incapable of operating without the use of real power stations which maintain and balance the grid baseload, these power stations have to always be turned on and kept running.

When a real power station always has to be on, to make up for the failings of magic green energy, then what is the point of having magic green energy?

Who has argued for that? This is about a ban on advertising for fossil fuel. It was you that came in with the long post and opinions.
Follow the argument to its logical conclusion instead of being short-sighted.
Are you also not aware that the sale of ICE vehicles are to be banned quite soon in Europe?
Have you not, uh, considered what the implications - reaching way beyond cars - are going to be?

Which is the actual argument to switching from them.
Switching to what. Do you really believe that magic electricity solutions can replace the petro-chemical industry & fossil fuels.
Things are not that simple in the real world.
I am sure you are just pro your lifestyle and you have some irrational fear that it's going to be taken away by a change from fossil fuels.
It's very easy for people who don't understand the ABC to believe how magic - told to them by Greta the prophet, their teachers, media and EUrocrats - is going to improve their lives.

I'm very rational because I understand the implications of these policies and the implications are not the land they are promising.
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by folderol »

Oh dear, have the extreme shouty folk even taken over here :roll:
The Yoshimi guy {apparently now an 'elderly'}
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Re: EU citizen's initiative for a new law on fossil fuel ads

Post by Loki Harfagr »

Yeah, dunno whzap, after playing was quietly coming backstage and the music was soothing
And they all started grooving Yeah, yeah, yeah-yeah-yeah then a man in the back said, "Everyone attack" and it turned into a ballroom blitz :cry:
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